pip and universal credits

Robert1111

can anyone please explain to me why if you receive the higher rate for both components of PIP.... if you are on universal credits you are not entitled to any of the disability premiums but if you receive ESA , then you are entitled to the disability premiums???? it makes no sense to me. Also, people on ESA already have the advantage of being paid 250 pounds per fortnight but folk on universal credits are only paid 348 per month... That extra 152 pounds per month, could help a lot, and then with receiving any of the disability premiums .... life could be a lot more comfortable! surely this isn't fair . Can anyone please help me understand this or explain what i am missing ?

  robert

calcotti

Robert1111 said:

can anyone please explain to me why if you receive the higher rate for both components of PIP.... if you are on universal credits you are not entitled to any of the disability premiums 

Quite simply it is because Universal Credit does not include any disability premiums. That is how the government designed it. It is a political decision.

Bear in mind however that someone in the ESA Support Group without a Severe Disability Premium actually gets more on UC than on ESA.

Robert1111 said:

Also, people on ESA already have the advantage of being paid 250 pounds per fortnight but folk on universal credits are only paid 348 per month... 

I don't understand what you are comparing here or how your figures are arrived at.
The UC amount for a single person who does not get LCWRA is £334.91/month. If they have LCWRA (equivalent to ESA Support Group) they get an additional £354.38/month making a total of £689.29/month.

A single income based ESA claimant in the Support Group gets £135.35/week - equivalent to £585.52/month.

The LCWRA element is set at a level which covers both the ESA Support group and the Enhanced Disability Premium.

Principally, those who are worse off on UC than they would on the old ESA are those who would get the SDP in the ESA. As said in first paragraph that is a political decision.

poppy123456

If you never claimed legacy benefits to be entitled to the SDP then you're not missing out on anything because you never claimed it to start with.

Robert1111

thank you for the replies. i dont know if i am being really thick here but i dont undersatnd what LCWRA is? In the area where i live no one can get ESA anymore but if you were on it before then you still get it. My confusions is why are people on esa entitled to these premiums but if you are on universal credit you cant! when to me it already seems pretty clear no matter what your situation is on universal credits if your single you get 348 per month but if its esa your getting 500 per month , then whatever premium if your entitled to one. Theres a big diffrence or again am i being really thick??

chiarieds

LCWRA= limited capability for work & work related activity; LCW = limited capability for work. Please see: https://www.gov.uk/universal-credit/what-youll-get

poppy123456

If you have a health condition that limits your capability for work then you need to report a change of circumstances and report your health condition. You will need to send a fit note from your GP within 7 days of this. You will then be referred for a work capability assessment. Same procedure as with ESA. See link.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/universal-credit-if-you-have-a-disability-or-health-condition-quick-guide/universal-credit-if-you-have-a-disability-or-health-condition
If you’re found to have LCWRA then you will receive extra money from the 4th month after you reported your health condition.
Calcotti has already explained the differences between ESA and UC and when claiming UC there are no disability premiums available. 

Income related ESA is no longer available in all areas because UC has replaced this.

calcotti

Robert1111 said:.. it already seems pretty clear no matter what your situation is on universal credits if your single you get 348 per month ..

That is simply not correct. As I tried to explain in my previous answer someone on UC in a similar position gets extra money due to their limitation for work. On ESA that is known as the Support Group and someone in the Support Group also gets an Enhanced Disability Premium. On UC it is called LCWRA and is worth more than the Combined Support Group and Enhanced Disability Premium.

calcotti said:

The UC amount for a single person who does not get LCWRA is £334.91/month. If they have LCWRA (equivalent to ESA Support Group) they get an additional £354.38/month making a total of £689.29/month.

A single income based ESA claimant in the Support Group gets £135.35/week - equivalent to £585.52/month.

Principally, those who are worse off on UC than they would on the old ESA are those who would get the SDP in the ESA. 

Robert1111

thank you, i think i now get it so if you do get the higher rate of pip for both components then tell this to the universal credit coach and then get a fit note from the GP and you should then get put on LCWRA? am i now on the right track?? i am really sorry about this, i just don't know and just trying to find the best guidance but also some clarity 

poppy123456

Robert1111 said:

thank you, i think i now get it so if you do get the higher rate of pip for both components then tell this to the universal credit coach and then get a fit note from the GP and you should then get put on LCWRA? am i now on the right track??

No, that’s not correct. PIP and LCWRA are 2 completely different benefits and claiming one doesn’t automatically entitle you to the other. 

If you report a health condition and send in fit notes you will need a work capability assessment. Some people will automatically be entitled to LCWRA and you can see that in points 1-3 at the top of this link https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/universal-credit-uc/uc-faq/limited-capability-for-work-related-activity
See link for the work capability assessment. Although it says ESA it’s exactly the same procedure. https://chdauk.co.uk/your-assessment/types-of-assessments/employment-and-support-allowance-esa/

calcotti

LCWRA in UC (or the Support Group in ESA) are assessed on a set of descriptors which are supposed to assess your ability to work.
PIP has nothing to do with work.

Robert1111

i get it now thank you. so when you mentioned you get paid 4 month later if your granted LWCRA, does this get backdated from the date of your first fit note?

poppy123456

Robert1111 said:

i get it now thank you. so when you mentioned you get paid 4 month later if your granted LWCRA, does this get backdated from the date of your first fit note?

The extra money isn't paid at all during the 3 month waiting period. It's paid from the 4th month. However, it may take longer than 3 months to make a decision, if this happens then you will receive any money owed, if found to have LCWRA.

You will be sent the work capability assessment form to fill in and return with all your evidence.

calcotti

Robert1111 said:

i get it now thank you. so when you mentioned you get paid 4 month later if your granted LWCRA, does this get backdated from the date of your first fit note?

The LCWRA status is backdated to the date the health condition is reported but there is no extra money paid until the fourth month.