Fit notes -Pip-Lwrca

Struggles_R

Just a quick query, 

Do you haft to provide fit notes to your universal credit account continuously to get your back pay.  So for example if you have fit notes from January right through to August with no gaps within the fit notes themselves, but you forget to apply them to your journal, will you still get back pay despite the fact that you received no expiration notifications in the missed periods? I’ve had fit notes since January-August expecting another tomorrow untill December but have completely forgot to put in march n april’s notes. Will I get paid from April until award date or will it be from July? Reason I ask is it was not my fault the uc failed to remind me of this 

poppy123456

They must be continuous, as advised on your other thread here. https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/94749/lcwra-pip-will-i-get-back-pay-can-i-get-both-at-the-same-time#latest

If there's a gap then it's likely the waiting period will start from when they were continuous. It will be down to a decision maker to make the final decision.

You also need to take into consideration the full 3 month assessment period waiting time, as it's not paid at all during that time, as previous explained on your other thread.

Struggles_R

If there's a gap then it's likely the waiting period will start from when they were continuous. It will be down to a decision maker to make the final decision.

You also need to take into consideration the full 3 month assessment period waiting time, as it's not paid at all during that time, as previous explained on your other thread.

Ok. If It happens to be that and they are not willing to give a back pay can I challenge this.  I can prove I had requested fit note before expiration date when I called prior but was not issued as my doctor was on annual leave. I have a two month period they were not dated onto my Uc account and a 2 day period as my conditions effect my memory and I also forgot to update it to my Jernoul today. Fit note was due yesterday but doctor unavailable untill today ?

poppy123456

I don't think challenging the gap in your fit note will help because the rules are that there must be no gaps.

Struggles_R

poppy123456 said:

I don't think challenging the gap in your fit note will help because the rules are that there must be no gaps.

But if the rule was broken because of a professional error and not myself, is it not un just to hold me accountable for this 

poppy123456

I can only tell you the rules for UC and that a continuous fit note is needed, otherwise it can affect when the LCWRA element is paid from.

maddanj

Hi,

I had no gap per se but UC DM have said I did not "declare" fit notes for a period of 9 months so cannot pay arrears back to start of claim. These 'missing' fit notes were 3 x 3 months fit notes which I declared in my journal and posted to the JC from July 2020 to Apr 2021 when they were in a state of flux.

I kept messaging for advice and was told to keep them as they didn't know what todo with them. I posted them regardless. I also uploaded to ESA who have awarded me support group and full arrears back 3 years.

My UC case manager can see I have put a journal entry in with the start and end dates of the fit notes for all periods when there was no Fit Note task in the To Do tab of UC system. I think they are being disingenious as I've done all I can to declare them. The Case Manager will not call me to have a discussion which can avoid a MR.

poppy123456

@maddanj it would have been better to start a new thread rather than ask on someone else's because it causes confusion.

You will need to request the MR on the decision not to backdate the LCWRA. Do remember though that there's a full 3 month assessment period waiting time and the extra money is paid from the 4th month.

maddanj

@poppy123456 
Thanks for your response. As my experience was relevant to the thread, I posted it in response for when others are searching for a similar issue who also found the issue with fit note declarations and the case where DM will be looking for a reason not to pay full arrears.

I'm not at the stage where I need an MR. DWP guidance states that an initial discussion can resolve the need for an MR. I'm cognisant of the assessment period and have already been awarded the full back payment to the 13th week of my claim by ESA decision maker. It's only UC that are questioning the non declaration of fit notes. I have a meeting with CAB to help build the case to resolve this without an MR.

poppy123456

The MR would be much easier. You're already in the Support Group for ESA so UC don't have a reason not to pay you the LCWRA for the same time.

calcotti

The grounds for MR are simply revision of the UC claim because you were in ESA Support Group for the period in question therefore entitled to be treated as having LCWRA status - the Fit Note group on the UC record is irrelevant.

maddanj

Thanks @poppy123456 and @calcotti

I've had a call with CAB who confirmed ESA takes precedence in this case and they have an approach to resolve the duplication of arrears payment by UC - who paid smaller amount of arrears - to resolve this who are checking with the specialist team on case law about the fit notes declaration issue.

It's not a case of MR at this stage but  an issue caused by poor UC and ESA administration and lack of communication between these 2 departments. 

As DWP guidance states, the best route is to have an initial discussion with the Case Manager to clarify and try to resolve before an MR.

poppy123456

Do be aware that when UC do pay you the arrears you will then have an overpayment of UC because you would have received some money from ESA as well. The ESA is deducted in full from UC, so if you received the full amount from UC at the same time, you would have been paid twice.

maddanj

@poppy123456

Absolutely - as I have been paid arrears by both ESA and UC. Hence establishing the award, payment and arrears from ESA as the precedent to be able to return the lower amount or arrears from UC as they are the ones disputing that 3 of my fit notes weren't "declared".

poppy123456 said:

Do be aware that when UC do pay you the arrears you will then have an overpayment of UC because you would have received some money from ESA as well. The ESA is deducted in full from UC, so if you received the full amount from UC at the same time, you would have been paid twice.