overpayment

teddybear123456789

Just say you were selling the house at the time of COVID, you did not had the money to spend on the family, there was no work and any income. I had no option to turn to claim benefit. I was not doing well in renting the house after 6 months the property condition was left in poor state by Tenants, so all rental income went in repair,Maintenance and wear and tear. So this is the reason I was selling the property and also my main residence was too small for the family it had 2 bedrooms and we were 6 person in total.

I was confused with Capital included in property, as my understanding was capital was only savings in bank account and did not know the 2nd property was classified as capital. So this is where mis understanding.

I did not claim council tax benefit as they told me if you have 2nd property you won’t be entitled to help on the council tax benefit and I never claimed. I was on Working tax credit prior to UC and I was paying full council tax , then when covid hit , I had no income I was self employed Driver and I had no option to turn for help and I was told to claim UC.

So now I have been told to pay the overpayment for 2 years of UC.

Please confirm if there is advice on this. as I genuinely honestly got confused with capital and property   , otherwise this would of been mentioned and when UC requested the information I gave them all the information, as I had nothing to hide and it was all submitted by my accountant as I was self employed driver and it used to go HRMC.

This only happened when I claimed UC and it got flagged up.

I explained to the UC Decision team and they said you will need to payback 2 years UC as you were not entitled due to 2nd property. I explained them above , as we’re selling the property due to loss and also our main property was too small , Mould, Damp and overcrowding.

I havd now mandatory or after that appeal.

calcotti

Unfortunately a second property is indeed capital and should have been declared.  The value of the property means that you were not entitled to UC. The second property can be disregarded if it was on the market for sale.

poppy123456

It does ask this question when you claim UC.

Tori_Scope

Welcome to the community @teddybear123456789  

This isn't something I know too much about, but I can see you've had some input from our members on your thread already. It sounds like a stressful situation. How are you doing today?

You may find it helpful to read about this on Turn2Us' website.

Disregarded Property

A property that you own and do not live in usually counts as capital for benefits. The amount of capital that you have can affect how much you receive in benefits.

If a property is disregarded, it is not counted as capital for benefits.

Your property is disregarded for 6 months if you do not live in it and you:

• Left due to a break-up with your partner
• Took steps to put it on the market
• Bought and plan to move into it
• Sought legal advice or started legal proceedings to occupy it
• Moved out so essential repairs could be carried out and you plan to move back in

Money can be disregarded for 6 months too, if it is:

• Proceeds of the sale of your home, to be used to buy a new home
• Home Insurance payout received for damage to your home
• Loans taken out for renovations to your home

If you feel you need some expert advice on this, you could search on advicelocal.uk to see what's available in your area

teddybear123456789

Thank you for your reply.

 

Like I said I did not wanted to claim benefit, as my circumstance changed during the covid, as I had no income and I had my 2nd house up for sale, as it was too much for me handling with the Tenants and the amount of money I earned in rent used to go back into the property. So there was no gain or extra money to spend for personal use.

 

When you are trying to sell a property it is not easy to sell straight away , as it can take time, as I needed the money to pay for the bills , feeding the family.

 

At the time I got CONFUSED with the CAPITAL, as I thought this is only to do with Savings and the Property is not classed as CAPITAL , now I know Property is Capital, otherwise I would of mentioned this, as this was already mentioned to HRMC and my accountant when I was self employed, when I submitted my self Assessment.

 

However it was Genuine mistake or miss understanding , at the time like I did not even claim council tax benefit, as I know you cannot claim council tax benefit if you have 2nd property, so I paid full council tax.

 

I wanted to explain to UC , I had no income during the covid, I was selling the 2nd house and also the main house as well, but finding the buyers and the going through chain of buyers, it was difficult to sell straight away.

 

If I did not claim UC i don’t how I would of paid the bills, pay for Food, Pay for clothing, feeding the family and so on, as I had no savings or income at the time and could not sell the property in time.

 

I wanted to explain this on the Mandatory Decision so they look at it , as I know they said we need to pay back for 2 years UC, but they can look into by seeing the situation I was in.

poppy123456

When you claimed UC it does ask you if you have any other property.

teddybear123456789 said:

At the time I got CONFUSED with the CAPITAL, as I thought this is only to do with Savings and the Property is not classed as CAPITAL

However it was Genuine mistake or miss understanding , at the time like I did not even claim council tax benefit, as I know you cannot claim council tax benefit if you have 2nd property, so I paid full council tax.

 

The same rules applies to all means tested benefits, including UC. Had you told them you had the property at the time then it could have been disregarded for at least 6 months, sometimes longer but it would have been down to a decision maker to make that decision.

Did the property sell? If so was there any equity in that property?

calcotti

Regardless of whether or not it was a mistake and even if a mistake is made by DWP any overpayment of UC is recoverable.

If you have proof that the property was on sale at the time and the measures you were taking to sell it you applied for UC then you could argue that although you should have declared the property it would have fallen to be disregarded (because you were trying to sell it) and therefore your nondisclosure made no difference to your entitlement. The disregard is normally for a six month period but can be extended if a Decision Maker deems it reasonable to do so.

teddybear123456789

Hi Decision Maker

First of all I would like to Apologies for this inconvenience caused.

 

However I would like to explain the situation regarding the 2nd property I had.

 

I was living with my Family and children, however this was my second marriage and I had children with my first Wife, but I have been divorced Long time ago and I got married again and I had 4 Beautiful children with my second wife.

 

We had ups and down with the marriage and I was working long hours on being on the Road and did not spend time with the family or children over the years to earn a living and feed the family.

 

I used to see my previous marriage children and my current wife used to argue felt that I was not giving time to current wife children.

 

We used to argue a lot and for the sake of the kids I moved out just to keep peace in the house and I used to live in my 2nd home for time being, so the children don’t feel scared, as they were getting upset with me and my wife arguing. 

 

I was getting mentally disturbed due to arguing and I wanted to be on me own for a while, so I can Rehabilitation from this situation.

 

When Our relationship was getting better, we feel we need to get back together for the kids sake , as our main residence was too small for the family it had 2 bedrooms and we were 6 person in total and it had Mould, Damp and it had lot essential work needed to be carried out and it was already overcrowded. 

 

 My health has deteriorated over the time, as I had a heart attack, Stem put it, I have High Blood Pressure , Gout and other illnesses, which my lifestyle is taking so many toll and i have to take so many medications. I  am not a well person and it is very hard and difficult to be in this situation when your health is not good and you are just mentally, physically and emotionally tired of these illnesses and taking medication and having  side effects from the medication. I had to look for a different job, as the Dr would not pass my medical to be self employed driver. 

 

 We got an estimate from the Architect and Builder and it was costing too much to renovate the house and extension due to it having a lot of work needed and the best option was to sell both houses and buy another    house to cater for the six of us. 

 

So this is why we put both houses on Market as our Main Residence was too small and needed lot of work and could not afford to do it up and the 2nd property it was not doing well in renting the house after 6 months the property condition was left in poor state by Tenants, so all rental income went in repair, Maintenance and wear and tear. Renting was not for me, as I did not see any gain at all. So this is the reason I was selling both the properties and buying one Main residence house, so we can live comfortably. We were struggling financially and made the decision selling the 2nd property is not for us and we were just living in 2 bedrooms house where we were sleeping on top of one another.

 

We had already borrowed money from family and friends  which we had to pay back by time given and we were struggling to payback and had to sell the property, as we just could not manage to pay them on time as promised. We are still owing money which we borrowed and asked for extension, as we did not had enough money to fully purchased the property.

 

When you are trying to sell a property it is not easy to sell straight away , as it can take time, as I needed the money to pay for the bills , feeding the family. We had buyers for the property, but the Mortgage was not going through and it just kept on delaying until we can find a suitable buyer to buy the house.

 

At the time I got CONFUSED with the CAPITAL, as I thought this is only to do with Savings and the Property is not classed as CAPITAL , now I know Property is Capital, otherwise I would of mentioned this, as this was already mentioned to HRMC and my accountant when I was self employed Driver, when I submitted self Tax Assessment.

 

However it was Genuine mistake or miss understanding , at the time like I did not even claim council tax benefit, as I know you cannot claim council tax benefit if you have 2nd property, so I paid full council tax, as the Council Tax advisor told me on the phone.

 

I wanted to explain to UC , I had no income during the covid, I was selling the 2nd house and also the main house as well, but finding the buyers and the going through chain of buyers, it was difficult to sell straight away.

 

 If I did not claim UC i don’t how I would of paid the bills, pay for Food, Pay for clothing, feeding the family and so on, as I had no savings or income at the time and could not sell the property in time.

 I did not know you had to tell them about the property you are selling, as this is new for me and it was first time I claimed UC. 

 

Please can you look into this                    

teddybear123456789

just wanted your help if i write for the mandatory would this be ok

poppy123456

I found that difficult to follow. In one part you said you didn't know that your other house was classed as capital and you were confused and thought it was only savings that counted.

Yet in the next paragragh you said you didn't claim council tax reduction because you knew you couldn't if you had a 2nd house, so that's a contradiction.

All you can do at this stage is send it and let a decision maker make that final decision.

woodbine

If I'm honest I would have to say that the letter as above would be of no help t all, they are not interested in a potted history of you family (families) only an explanation as to why you didn't think the second property was capital, which I would have to say would be classed as capital, it's not what you want to hear but I doubt you have a "leg to stand on" so to speak

janer1967

Hi 

Personally I would say the letter goes into far too much unnecessary detail try and cut it back to make it more impacted 

teddybear123456789

Hi Janer1967 

Would you be kind enough to help me how to write it , so it can have a more of a impact, so I can explain better to the UC Mandatory decision makers thank you

poppy123456

I'm sorry but i can't help you do this because it's just not possible on any internet forum. You'll just need to tell them why you didn't report having the property when it does ask you that exact question when you claim. Keep the letter exactly to the point without telling your life story as you did above.

You can also get some expert advice from an agency near you. https://advicelocal.uk/

janer1967

Hi sorry I can't help as I won't be around for a while 

As poppy says above its hard to write something for somebody else you don't know and I would suggest cab or welfare rights or maybe a friend or family could help

Hannah_Scope

Hello @teddybear123456789

I do agree that the letter written was a lot of information to give but I understand that it is such a frustrating and stressful time, so you want to say everything once as to not to keep repeating. 

As Poppy has suggest Advice Local will be able to help you as well as Citizen's Advice like Janer suggested.