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Managing Therapies descriptor thoughts.

NasmamuNasmamu Member Posts: 45 Connected
edited July 2017 in PIP, DLA and AA
 Hi 
I know I'm probably clutching at straws here but just wanted your thoughts (I have CP, Spastic Diplegia). The Managing Therapies descriptor on the daily living part of PIP, can this include massaging oils my wife uses on my legs and arm to help relax tired/painful muscles at the end of an evening. She normally does this for approx 30-45mins every night and this also helps greatly with stiffness and spasms I get during the night. 

Many Thanks 

Replies

  • MatildaMatilda Member Posts: 2,616 Disability Gamechanger
    @Nasmamu

    You could argue that this is necessary therapy and that you cannot manage to massage yourself so someone has to do it for you.
  • GeoarkGeoark Member, Scope Volunteer Posts: 1,375 Disability Gamechanger
    @Nasmamu

    Having looked into this it would seem it would depend on who prescribed the therapy:
    What is ‘therapy’ in relation to personal independence payment (PIP)?

    In relation to personal independence payment (PIP), “therapy” means therapy to be undertaken at home which is prescribed or recommended by 
    a—
    (a) registered – 
    (i) doctor;
    (ii) nurse; or 
    (iii) pharmacist; or 
    (b) health professional regulated by the Health Professions Council;

    Source: https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/personal-independence-payment-pip/glossary/1963-therapy

    If this was not prescribed by one of the above I would suggest posting the question in the ask an advisor section to check if this is correct.

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  • NasmamuNasmamu Member Posts: 45 Connected
    Geoark said:
    @Nasmamu

    Having looked into this it would seem it would depend on who prescribed the therapy:
    What is ‘therapy’ in relation to personal independence payment (PIP)?

    In relation to personal independence payment (PIP), “therapy” means therapy to be undertaken at home which is prescribed or recommended by 
    a—
    (a) registered – 
    (i) doctor;
    (ii) nurse; or 
    (iii) pharmacist; or 
    (b) health professional regulated by the Health Professions Council;

    Source: https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/personal-independence-payment-pip/glossary/1963-therapy

    If this was not prescribed by one of the above I would suggest posting the question in the ask an advisor section to check if this is correct.
    Yes saw this after posting, based on this the answer would be a big fat NO. As with most adults with CP, care after 18yrs old is a no no. The massaging oils therapy was something somebody (Not a recognised for pip purposes person) recommended about 3yrs ago and it helped immeasurably back then for about 2yrs. Not so much this past 12 months. It helps but still get the odd pain/spasm which causes me to wake up a few times in the night. Oh well looks like ill have to find points elsewhere. Actually came on to post another question and saw your reply. Thank You
  • Sam_AlumniSam_Alumni Scope alumni Posts: 7,730 Disability Gamechanger
    @Debbie_Scope would it be worth putting all this down anyway? 
    Scope
    Senior online community officer
  • steve51steve51 Member Posts: 7,175 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi Nasmamu.

    Welcome to our community I do hope that we can offer you both support/advice.

    From past experience I would say that the more you put in the "better"
  • BenefitsTrainingCoBenefitsTrainingCo Member Posts: 2,692 Pioneering
    Hello nasmamu - as other people have pointed out, you can only get points under this managing therapy activity if it has been prescribed or recommended by one of the above professionals, and in addition you have to show that a failure to receive this therapy is likely to result in a deterioration in your health. Given the nature of the wording, might it be possible to make a case anyway, and ask your doctor or practice nurse to write a brief letter saying that this is a therapy which they 'recommend', as it has proven positive effects and if it was not done for you (as you cannot do it yourself) then your health would be negatively affected? As Sam says, everything is relevant and helps paint the picture of how daily life is managed, but to be properly effective you have to zoom in on where you could score points, and there are two available here if you can get the right evidence! Perhaps when you have sorted out likely descriptors for the other points you need, you could ask your doctor to write a supporting letter which covers all the activities and descriptors which apply to you. Medical evidence is very helpful if it is specific. Perhaps your wife could also write a statement saying why she does this for you, the positive effects it has, and the physical consequences if she didn't do it. It all helps. 
    Good luck with your claim!
    Jayne
    The Benefits Training Co:
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    Michael Chambers
    Will Hadwen
    Sarah Hayle
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  • Debbie_ScopeDebbie_Scope Member Posts: 947 Pioneering
    Hi @Nasmamu,

    You're not clutching at straws at all with this question and I would definitely encourage you to include the information about the massages in your application.
    The PIP Assessment Guide (p.104 Activity 3).

    This activity takes into account the administration of medication or therapy irrespective of who delivers it, and includes delivery by healthcare professionals, such as district or community psychiatric nurses. It only applies to medication/therapy delivered in the home environment i.e. where the claimant lives (and may include care homes), that has been prescribed/recommended by a registered healthcare professional or pharmacist. Examples of prescribed or recommended medication include tablets, inhalers, creams, suppositories and enemas. Therapies could include domiciliary dialysis, nebulisers and exercise regimes to prevent 105 complications, such as contractures. Whilst medications and therapies do not necessarily have to be prescribed, there must be a consensus of medical opinion that supports their use in treatment of the condition, hence the necessity for it at least to be recommended by a registered healthcare professional or pharmacist. 

    "manage therapy" means undertake therapy, where a failure to do so is likely to result in a deterioration in [the claimant's] health

    The advice from Jayne above is really good. Talk to your GP, it's quite likely that they will support you. Even though the massages aren't prescribed they are still necessary. It's still an essential therapy that is being given to you each day to help prevent you from a deterioration. There is lots of evidence around supporting the use of massage in CP and I think it's very relevant to your claim.

    Let us know how you get on with this.

    Best wishes
    Debbie
  • mossycowmossycow Member Posts: 495 Pioneering
    Not an expert but yes, worth a gp  or nurse appointment to discuss this and get their support. I paid for a supporting letter but compared to receiving PIP it was worth it. Best of luck

    "I'm trying to live like a random poem I read that ended 'to bloom where we are planted"

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