PIP phone assessment

DianeW64

Hello 
My husband has claimed PiP for the first time, with my help after a lot of research on completing the forms in line with descriptors etc.

He had his phone assessment this morning and just an hour later a txt to say the report has been sent to DWP.

He was very very nervous and with my help was able to answer the questions ok, he has asthma, COPD, heart disease, diabetes, osteoarthritis, cellulitis and is 64.

He has struggled to work as a career for a while then received COPD, asthma and heart diagnosis…is awaiting urgent aortic valve replacement.

He is so stressed about it as was a real ordeal for him, I am also worried, but will appeal if necessary.

The assessor seemed nice and allowed him time, she seemed to understand and commented on some of his illnesses, so who knows?

The waiting begins……..

bg844

You should expect a decision within 12 weeks, I hope it's good news for him. You can also request a copy of his assessment report now if you wish but I do advise you to not bother, it can cause much more stress than is needed (I thought I'd point this out before other members 'recommend' it). Please do keep us up to date when he hears back.

DianeW64

bg844 said:

You should expect a decision within 12 weeks, I hope it's good news for him. You can also request a copy of his assessment report now if you wish but I do advise you to not bother, it can cause much more stress than is needed (I thought I'd point this out before other members 'recommend' it). Please do keep us up to date when he hears back.

I will thank you so much…this as I’m sure you all know is so consuming, we haven’t slept properly and I’m constantly researching information, but I can’t do anymore now….thanks for the help, this site is just amazing.

rebel11

Also if the decision doesn't go in your husband favour, you still have MR 23% success and Appeal 73% success so don't give up, post update so further advice can be provided.

DianeW64

rebel11 said:

Also if the decision doesn't go in your husband favour, you still have MR 23% success and Appeal 73% success so don't give up, post update so further advice can be provided.

Thank you I will be sure to update.

DianeW64

Update….My husband had a text message this morning advising him he has been awarded PIP, and will get a decision letter explaining award and to allow 2 weeks.

Cant believe how quick as he only had his phone assessment last week, hopefully he will get the award we have calculated, but so pleased after the stress.

This site is such a brilliant resource and people so helpful and knowledgeable, so thank you.

Hannah_Alumni

@DianeW64 That's great news! So pleased for him  

DianeW64

Well the decision letter came today and it’s disappointing, he scored 8 points for moving around so got low rate mobility.

For daily living he got 6pts, 2 for preparing food, 2 for washing and bathing, and 2 for dressing and undressing.

I feel he also met descriptors for -

communication, but letter said he understood all questions asked on phone assessment and didn’t need her to repeat - this isn’t true, I was sat by his side and repeated the question so he understood and he asked her a few times to repeat question.

managing therapy letter said he can take meds out packets and knows when and what to take - this isn’t true, I put his meds in dosette box and always remind him to take then if I didn’t do this he would get mixed up and not take them, he can’t read medication boxes or understand what each medication is for.

Letter states he passed a driving test which requires cognition and concentration, so he can manage these activities unaided - he passed his test 46 years ago!!!

There are other descriptor’s I feel he met, so now need to put together a MR, I am just struggling now myself and are scared of doing it wrong as just lost my Dad last week so could really do without this now.

Any advice would be appreciated - thanks 

nasturtium

Hello DianeW64

I am sorry to hear about the loss of your father last week.

You will need to do a Mandatory Reconsideration.

You must put your Mandatory Reconsideration in Letter format and do not telephone to request a MR because after you telephone it starts the clock ticking and they will do the MR without you providing vital and important extra written verbal anacdotal evidence and information to back up your claim.  You have 1 month from the date of your decision letter to write a detailed MR letter explaining all of the problems you have with the activities and why you cannot complete the 12 PIP activities that apply to you Reliably (The word reliably is a very important word in PIP because it is enshrined in law as Regulation 4(2A) of the Social Security (Personal Independence Payment) Regulations 2013 read more here https://pipinfo.net/issues/reliably and here https://www.mypipassessment.co.uk/updates/what-are-the-reliability-criteria-that-are-used-during-the-pip-consultation/ ) You also have 13 months to request a MR by Letter if you have a good reason for requesting a late MR for example the effects of your mental health or your disability stopped you form doing your MR or you were waiting for further medical evidence or advice from a welfare rights agency. If they refuse your MR letter for being late then you can go straight to appeal.

You need to include real life incidents that happened to your husband the last time he completed each PIP activity that applies to him. You need to describe in detail what happened, who witnessed it and what the consequences were.

This link will give you advice on what you need to include on your MR letter for each activity. It is about filling in the PIP form but if you did not give detail on your PIP2 Questionnaire form then now is the time to resolve that by giving detail in your MR letter. https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/sick-or-disabled-people-and-carers/pip/help-with-your-claim/fill-in-form-pip/

The Governments PIP Assessment Guide and Criteria (what they are looking for when doing an assessment for PIP) https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/personal-independence-payment-assessment-guide-for-assessment-providers/pip-assessment-guide-part-2-the-assessment-criteria

My advice is not to get to hung up on critisising the descision letter because that is not going to get an award. You need to focus on why he cannot do the PIP activities Reliably and focus on the descriptors because it is the descriptors that gets you the points for an award.

You will need to appeal if the MR is not successfull and the majority of MRs are not. If you do a detailed MR Letter then this will be used as extra evidence in a PIP appeal by the tribunal and it will increase the chances of you getting the award your husband is entitled to.

Hope that helps

Nasturtium

DianeW64

Thank you so much for the detailed post, I am going to do exactly as you advise and will sit tomorrow and begin the written MR, i will give the examples in full for each relevant descriptor and ensure I note why he is unable to do them - reliably…..and read the links provided.

I did do a thorough job of the form or so I thought, relating each question to descriptor, but the phone assessment didn’t cover everything and part of my husband’s problems are he gets mixed up with things said so I had to prompt him not only how to answer each question but what questions she asked.

I will not dwell on the errors but will note a few on the MR.

we are prepared to go to tribunal if necessary but hopefully they will change award.

They completely disregarded his MH issues because he has not sought help, but he can’t face it with all the other medical things he is currently dealing with….he is embarrassed and it’s took a lot for him to make this claim

Thank you 

poppy123456

The time to tell them about everything is when filling out the form. By doing this there would be less questions to ask during the assessment, or preferably have a paper based assessment because the form contained enough of information to complete that.

The assessment process isn't there to cover every single descriptor because there just wouldn't be enough of time to do that.

If the decision letter or the assessment report says something like " no evidence of MH issues because no help is being given" then this is a standard copy and paste they do seem to use a lot.

DianeW64

poppy123456 said:

The time to tell them about everything is when filling out the form. By doing this there would be less questions to ask during the assessment, or preferably have a paper based assessment because the form contained enough of information to complete that.

The assessment process isn't there to cover every single descriptor because there just wouldn't be enough of time to do that.

If the decision letter or the assessment report says something like " no evidence of MH issues because no help is being given" then this is a standard copy and paste they do seem to use a lot.

Thank you, yes I’m working on the MR today …… Not every question was a yes, those that were I answered fully giving examples…… will concentrate on the ones he didn’t score on and follow the advice I have been given here, want to get it sent off asap, will get it recorded. I didn’t ask for copy of the assessment report do you think I should?

poppy123456

You don't need to send it recorded delivery because it won't get there any quicker. It still has to go through the same mail sorting process as all mail going to DWP. It's not classed as arriving until it's been added to the computer. Proof of posting is all that's needed which is free from any post office.

You don't need the assessment report. It only causes a distraction anyway.

DianeW64

poppy123456 said:

You don't need to send it recorded delivery because it won't get there any quicker. It still has to go through the same mail sorting process as all mail going to DWP. It's not classed as arriving until it's been added to the computer. Proof of posting is all that's needed which is free from any post office.

You don't need the assessment report. It only causes a distraction anyway.

Oh I didn’t realise, I thought recorded was needed to prove it’s been received by them.

DianeW64

Can someone please confirm if I am requesting a MR of the whole thing or just where I think he should have scored points that he didn’t ? Do I have to include all questions that are relevant and link to descriptors etc or do I not need to mention the ones where points were awarded?

Just confused as read that a new decision maker assesses the whole thing, so in that case don’t want to leave things out …… I’m just swamped with this and it’s going to take me as long as the form did with everything I need to say!!!

StarGummy

For daily living he got 6pts, 2 for preparing food, 2 for washing and bathing, and 2 for dressing and undressing.

I feel he also met descriptors for -

communication, but letter said he understood all questions asked on phone assessment and didn’t need her to repeat - this isn’t true, I was sat by his side and repeated the question so he understood and he asked her a few times to repeat question.

I had the exact same experience! I'm Autistic, so communication isn't my strong point (especially on the phone!). I had my mother with me in case I froze up during the telephone assessment, which they knew about. I stuttered and took a long time to respond but because I "answered all the questions" I scored a 0 on communication. Despite telling them I am semi-verbal and sometimes use an AAC device. They also claimed things that weren't true for me too. 

I did end up getting the standard award but also scored 0 on a lot of categories I felt I should have gotten points on, (this was after a MR as well). I honestly did not have the courage to appeal a third time without new evidence, so I decided to just wait and settle with the standard rate until I am seen by a neurologist so they can help with new documentation (NHS waiting lists are so painfully long right now though). It's very disappointing that this happens to people, I really hope you can get them to listen!

DianeW64

PendularSand said:

For daily living he got 6pts, 2 for preparing food, 2 for washing and bathing, and 2 for dressing and undressing.

I feel he also met descriptors for -

communication, but letter said he understood all questions asked on phone assessment and didn’t need her to repeat - this isn’t true, I was sat by his side and repeated the question so he understood and he asked her a few times to repeat question.

I had the exact same experience! I'm Autistic, so communication isn't my strong point (especially on the phone!). I had my mother with me in case I froze up during the telephone assessment, which they knew about. I stuttered and took a long time to respond but because I "answered all the questions" I scored a 0 on communication. Despite telling them I am semi-verbal and sometimes use an AAC device. They also claimed things that weren't true for me too. 

I did end up getting the standard award but also scored 0 on a lot of categories I felt I should have gotten points on, (this was after a MR as well). I honestly did not have the courage to appeal a third time without new evidence, so I decided to just wait and settle with the standard rate until I am seen by a neurologist so they can help with new documentation (NHS waiting lists are so painfully long right now though). It's very disappointing that this happens to people, I really hope you can get them to listen!

Thank you, yes all the information I am trying to cover was on the form and reiterated on the phone assessment although my husband struggled a lot and I feel could have expanded some things, but he certainly covered things in detail he scored 0 for.

They have said he could do things he can’t but I have made a good start with prep today, will carry on tomorrow.

chiarieds

Hi @DianeW64 - when you write your MR, then yes, the whole of your husband's PIP award will be looked at again (unless a person were to say they agreed with the award but not the length of it). If applicable, dependent on the length of his award, you could also use this opportunity to say why you thought it should be longer, & exactly why.

As has been said, giving a couple of recent, detailed examples of the difficulties your husband faces really helps such as when did this happen, where was he, what exactly happened, why, did you or anyone else see what happened, & were there any consequences in attempting/doing each applicable activity/descriptor such as pain, fatigue, breathlessness?

The concept of 'reliability,' as also mentioned above, cannot be stressed enough, but PIP is also how you are the majority of days, so please also consider that. Also it can be about the help you need, even if a person doesn't get that help.

Unless there are one or at most 2 irrefutable 'inaccuracies' in his decision letter (ignoring some of the many 'cut & paste' replies that creep in), do concentrate on where you feel he should have gained points instead.

As well as the informative links above, & altho this links looks at applying for PIP, I do feel this one may sometimes give examples as to how someone might also struggle due to their mental health: https://www.mentalhealthandmoneyadvice.org/en/welfare-benefits/pip-mental-health-guide/help-with-your-pip-claim/how-to-fill-in-the-pip-form/

Keep a copy of everything & get a free 'Certificate of Posting' from your Post Office: https://personal.help.royalmail.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/475/~/what-is-a-certificate-of-posting?  This is all that's needed.

DianeW64

Thank you so much for all the help everyone takes their time to provide, I feel so much more aware of what I need to do and I will take all advice which is gratefully accepted.

chiarieds

It can take up to 12 weeks to get a decision on his MR, but kindly let us all know how you get on, & good luck!

DianeW64

I will definitely update