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Heads up - new sickness/disability benefit changes may be announced this week

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Comments

  • Hannah_Scope
    Hannah_Scope Posts: 7,316 Disability Gamechanger
    I just wanted to pop a comment on here as I know many people are worried and anxious. As members have said, these changes will come in after the next general election in 2025. Who knows what would happen by then? 

    I agree with so many people's comments and points on this topic. I hope it doesn't come to anything. The government have been known to make a U-turn or 12...

    I always encourage everyone to use their voice. Remember you can always reach out to your Local MP

    And please remember, the community is here if you need support <3 
    Hannah - She / Her

    Online Community Coordinator @ Scope

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  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Community member Posts: 52,417 Disability Gamechanger
    There's another thread regarding this here. https://forum.scope.org.uk/discussion/109654/heads-up-new-sickness-disability-benefit-changes-may-be-announced-this-week#latest @Hannah_Scope maybe it's worth joining both together so members don't get confused between the 2 threads? Thank you. 

    I would appreciate it if members wouldn't tag me please. I have all notifcations turned off and wouldn't want a member thinking i'm being rude by not replying.
    If i see a question that i know the answer to i will try my best to help.
  • MJ81
    MJ81 Community member Posts: 3 Listener
    Becky93 said:
    MJ81 said:
    Hi everyone, my first post here, sorry it had to be on a negative note.

    I was quite horrified to see this article in the Daily Fail this morning:-


    Now I only JUST got my first PIP award after fighting for over a decade to get it, and I see the Tories already want to take it away?

    My question for the community is, will these Tory plans likely affect my existing award in any way shape or form? Or is it for new claims / re-applications only?

    Id like to think the Torys really are toast next GE, but I personally know enough bigoted Mail readers to make me think its far from a full gone conclusion....

    thanks in advance

    It will only affect new applications and reassessments for sure, as it would require way too many resources to go back reassess everyone. They're already way behind in reassessments to begin with.

    I imagine being on PIP is a good thing, there's no mention of it here, but it was mentioned previously that they wanted to move the system to one assessment, the PIP assessment.

    There's no way this fully gets implemented before the next GE, and the Tories are surely going to lose. Unfortunately Labour, seem to be falling for the same right wing rubbish, so there's no guarantee they will put a stop to it, but you do probably have more chance with them. The best chance is Labour are more likely to go down the road of believing that cutting NHS wait times will cut the number of people claiming benefits for long term sickness, so just purely going after the people on benefits is likely to be less of a priority for them.

    Hi Becky, thankyou for your post - it was very informative indeed! Having only JUST received my PIP award after all these years, it does at least bring me some comfort that I wouldnt have to deal with any Tory shenanigans at least untill the next renewal date comes around.

    That said I do really feel for those that rely on ESA, I will be honest in that I didnt even know it was a thing untill this week!! In fact I didnt know half of what is available...

  • Hannah_Scope
    Hannah_Scope Posts: 7,316 Disability Gamechanger
    Thanks for tagging me Poppy :) 

    I can merge your comment's into the other thread if you'd like @happyfella? Many people having a discussion about the news on benefits this week. 
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  • happyfella
    happyfella Community member Posts: 478 Pioneering
    please if you can
  • apple85
    apple85 Community member Posts: 372 Pioneering
    edited September 2023
    I just wanted to pop a comment on here as I know many people are worried and anxious. As members have said, these changes will come in after the next general election in 2025. Who knows what would happen by then? 

    I agree with so many people's comments and points on this topic. I hope it doesn't come to anything. The government have been known to make a U-turn or 12...

    I always encourage everyone to use their voice. Remember you can always reach out to your Local MP

    And please remember, the community is here if you need support <3 
    I do agree with you Hannah

    But this attitude from the disabled community of thinking it’s a while off, or it will probably be u turned or another party may be in charge is sloppy thinking (think the hares logic in ‘the tortoise and the hare’ fable)

    For a start the last and current w&p ministers have come across as Tory clones so that’s a safety net (plus don’t rule out the tories out of the election yet)

    second - yes we have experienced several very quick u turns over the past few years but that is an unreliable safety net for the following:

    > when the tories have really wanted to get something done they’ll find a way to do it quickly (just look at the environmental pledge break announced by gove/Coffey less than 2 weeks back - that’s going through it’s 1st reading in Parliament right now). Also the scrapping of wca was only announced in March 2023. Stride admitted himself he wanted to fast forward things this tuesday. If these reforms are popular with Tory mps and members can you really rule out another fast forward when the November budget happens

    > Sunak is not the same animal as Boris - Boris wanted to be loved by everyone including the public which is partly why there was so many u-turns so quickly under him. Sunak thinks he’s brilliant even though most of the public have be vocal in either their dislike or indifference of him (and only 250 ppl wanted his - even truss was more popular which says it all). Basically he’s much harder to get a u turn out of (not impossible but public outcry would have to be pretty significant (I think his only u turns have come from pressure from party mps but I could be wrong

    > the election is only 16 months away - that’s not very long to begin and that’s kind of the mentality of starting your summer holidays from school and thinking you don’t have to do your homework day 1, but before you know it’s the final week and you still haven’t started on it (we’ve all done that at least once)
    the best case scenario is the 2025 earliest is accurate and these wca reforms get bulked out and add to their election manifesto (as the telegraph said these reforms could be very popular with a sizeable chunk of the public who don’t have all the background info/are educated in the subject) which isn’t pleasant all by itself.
    But we know that in their final year before election (unless they totally throw in towel) sunak needs to give his mps and the public red meat (aka splash the cash) and he’ll need to balance the books in doing so and taking away from benefit claimants (stereotypical scroungers) is probably public preference 


    because of that I’m 50/50 on if things will be left till post election or things getting sped up


    Honestly if I was a gambler I’d put money on a few weeks after the reform consultation ends in late October at the November budget Hunt announces they are going forward with worst case scenario and they aim to push through all 3 readings and put it in law in time for the next financial year starting April 2024 (it would be a tight turnaround of 3 months but tories still have a large majority and I can’t honestly see the lords slowing things down so it’s a real possibility). If the start of the financial year isn’t a factor that further increases the possibility of any dwp reforms being moved up the calendar 

    what I am certain of is u turns are more likely to happen early (soon after an announcement) when any possible public outrage is at its highest and it hasn’t been elapsed by another story.
    so if the disabled do want the gov either to rethink or bin these reforms that next 8 weeks is the best opportunity to flip things


    so on that note Hannah is 100% right in saying we’ve all got to use our voice - all I’m saying is the best opportunity for success or even just slowing the reform down to buy more time - and for that to happen as many of the disabled community need to be vocal and need to communicate (and in some cases educate) as many people as possible
    in an ideal world we need enough public backlash about these dwp reforms to knock everything else off the front pages and top stories several days - that is how u turns happen and policies change
    (and on an unrelated note in recent times how we get rid of dodgy ministers and mps!)
  • woodbine
    woodbine Community member Posts: 11,329 Disability Gamechanger
    You lost the argument when I saw the bit about immigrants, most by the way are asylum seekers I detest racism in all its forms and have reported your post for its content.
    2024 The year of the general election...the time for change is coming 💡

  • judie
    judie Community member Posts: 23 Courageous
    The government are going to have blood on their hands over this, not just after it's implemented but in the lead up to it. So many scared and hopeless feeling people. I'd like to say it's unbelievable that the politicians just don't care but we all know the truth
  • apple85
    apple85 Community member Posts: 372 Pioneering
    woodbine said:
    You lost the argument when I saw the bit about immigrants, most by the way are asylum seekers I detest racism in all its forms and have reported your post for its content.
    Was that aimed at me?
  • Community_Scope
    Community_Scope Posts: 888 Scope online community team

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  • Hannah_Scope
    Hannah_Scope Posts: 7,316 Disability Gamechanger
    @happyfella I have merged your comment over to this thread for you. Although reports are so far correct about the government spending £6 million. I hadn't heard about the 90% figure or did I miss-read and that is your opinion of the migrants coming over? If there is a figure can you post it here as I haven't seen that one.A lot of people will have thoughts on how government money should be spent. And from your comment you know that there are a lot of people who are fleeing war torn countries, persecutions for being part of the LGBTQ+ community or even for speaking against their government. And that they need asylum. I think it's a well known social actuality that the media like to vilify certain groups in different situations. An example would be how the disability community is represented in articles with words like "scroungers" and "lazy". Scope researched the attitudes towards disabled people and found 42% of those attitudes come from the public. Please read the comment above from @Community_Scope and be mindful of the sources of information you find :) There are articles out there that are published just to be inflammatory. 
    Hannah - She / Her

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  • Ralph
    Ralph Community member Posts: 77 Pioneering
    Setting one minority community against another is playing into the Government’s hands. I too am disgusted at some comments on this thread.
  • happyfella
    happyfella Community member Posts: 478 Pioneering
    @happyfella I have merged your comment over to this thread for you. Although reports are so far correct about the government spending £6 million. I hadn't heard about the 90% figure or did I miss-read and that is your opinion of the migrants coming over? If there is a figure can you post it here as I haven't seen that one.A lot of people will have thoughts on how government money should be spent. And from your comment you know that there are a lot of people who are fleeing war torn countries, persecutions for being part of the LGBTQ+ community or even for speaking against their government. And that they need asylum. I think it's a well known social actuality that the media like to vilify certain groups in different situations. An example would be how the disability community is represented in articles with words like "scroungers" and "lazy". Scope researched the attitudes towards disabled people and found 42% of those attitudes come from the public. Please read the comment above from @Community_Scope and be mindful of the sources of information you find :) There are articles out there that are published just to be inflammatory. 


  • Hannah_Scope
    Hannah_Scope Posts: 7,316 Disability Gamechanger
    @apple85 Oh I have a few ideas about how to get rid of dodgy ministers and MPs :D

    Although they could push a reform, it won't help their popularity so I personally don't see it happening. But I can see where you are 50/50 and the worry that brings for so many people. 

    I still think things like disability benefits need to be taken off the political agenda. Having a committee that gives some stability to those claiming and less fear mongering with every political announcement would be life changing. 
    Hannah - She / Her

    Online Community Coordinator @ Scope

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  • apple85
    apple85 Community member Posts: 372 Pioneering
    woodbine, happyfella and Ralph 

    I have several things (not all the same) I want to say to each but I think it’s best for the most part.

    all 3 of you have reminded me why I hide myself and enhanced a reason why these reforms won’t work if they are indeed solely to ‘help’ (and not a sole cost saving exercise) that even the likes of suella braverman and sunak have a good chance of understanding.
  • happyfella
    happyfella Community member Posts: 478 Pioneering
    apple85 said:
    woodbine, happyfella and Ralph 

    I have several things (not all the same) I want to say to each but I think it’s best for the most part.

    all 3 of you have reminded me why I hide myself and enhanced a reason why these reforms won’t work if they are indeed solely to ‘help’ (and not a sole cost saving exercise) that even the likes of suella braverman and sunak have a good chance of understanding.

    well i feel like i am being robbed. I worked all my life and now i am seeing more than £6million a day housing migrants when that money could be used to improve the NHS and to help pensioners and those with disabilities. The Government says they have no money but they are more than happy to waste £6 million a day.

    That is our money. Would you like one of your neighbours to come to you are take some of your money because that is what it is like.

    You have your opinion and i have mine. These people are coming from France which is a safe country. They are coming here because we are an easy target and we silly enough say come on then abuse our benefit system. but no one mentions that. No one questions why they are coming from a safe country to ours and the answer is simple, the french will not give them what we give them.

    Real people at risk, then i agree they need help but why is it always the UK who offers that help. France will not help them like us. We are fools simple as.
  • judie
    judie Community member Posts: 23 Courageous
    What about the migrants who  are pensioners and/or disabled?Any compassion for them?
  • woodbine
    woodbine Community member Posts: 11,329 Disability Gamechanger
    apple85 said:
    woodbine, happyfella and Ralph 

    I have several things (not all the same) I want to say to each but I think it’s best for the most part.

    all 3 of you have reminded me why I hide myself and enhanced a reason why these reforms won’t work if they are indeed solely to ‘help’ (and not a sole cost saving exercise) that even the likes of suella braverman and sunak have a good chance of understanding.

    well i feel like i am being robbed. I worked all my life and now i am seeing more than £6million a day housing migrants when that money could be used to improve the NHS and to help pensioners and those with disabilities. The Government says they have no money but they are more than happy to waste £6 million a day.

    That is our money. Would you like one of your neighbours to come to you are take some of your money because that is what it is like.

    You have your opinion and i have mine. These people are coming from France which is a safe country. They are coming here because we are an easy target and we silly enough say come on then abuse our benefit system. but no one mentions that. No one questions why they are coming from a safe country to ours and the answer is simple, the french will not give them what we give them.

    Real people at risk, then i agree they need help but why is it always the UK who offers that help. France will not help them like us. We are fools simple as.
    rent figures would suggest that Germany have taken in 1.5 million refugees/assylum seekers, in the last 18 months we have rightly allowed tens of thousands Ukrainians to seek reguge here, would you send them back?
    2024 The year of the general election...the time for change is coming 💡

  • happyfella
    happyfella Community member Posts: 478 Pioneering
    if you look at the official government figures, most of the people coming over are men and young men at that. Again my question is, why come from france which is a safe country to our country and the answer is because of what we give them. we welcome them with open arms and give them benefits. They have even said that themselves on camera and in a recent interview with the media. One even filmed his journey over and his hotel. 

    France doesnt want them, so no matter how much we waste on paying the french to stop them crossing over, they still come and that is because of our benefit system. So why is the government taking it out on disabled people when they are more than happy to waste taxpayers money
  • apple85
    apple85 Community member Posts: 372 Pioneering
    @apple85 Oh I have a few ideas about how to get rid of dodgy ministers and MPs :D

    Although they could push a reform, it won't help their popularity so I personally don't see it happening. But I can see where you are 50/50 and the worry that brings for so many people. 

    I still think things like disability benefits need to be taken off the political agenda. Having a committee that gives some stability to those claiming and less fear mongering with every political announcement would be life changing. 
    Agreed 

    I don’t know how much say mods like yourself have on scope policies, campaigns etc…….. or if anything on the forums makes itself noticed to the scopes higher ups

    scope has probably one of the biggest uk online disabled communities at least in terms of forum interaction. Therefore it’s probably one of the best organisations placed to start a dwp reforms fight back campaign (don’t quote me on the title) as news sources will actually publish your quotes and anything similar

    id love it if there was the Martin Luther King of the uk sick/disabled that could gather & organise the disabled masses and who’d be listened by the masses but I don’t think the uk disabled have anything like that which is why ideally an established disability charity would start something or even better a cross charity alliance 

    I guess by now you’ve figured out I’m a huge forward planner, (over)plan for all possible scenarios and if I was a chess player I’d hope I’d be able to plan several moves ahead - I desperately want to be proactive and jump on action against these reforms and contribute to shutting them down before they even make official gov policy (I want to u turn it before it’s even officially possible to u-turn) but I have enough common sense to know I’m best place to jump on a big movement/campaign but right now that does not exist which is frustrating (I may share one of my disabilities with Greta Thunberg but it think her parents position in society (aka who she knew) placed a huge part in her success - I’m very aware that my best bet is to be an insignificant nut or bolt)

    so I’d be very open to anyone from scope who reads this to private message me - as I said the majority may think it’s too early to organise something if at all but I think the sooner individuals and the whole community think it’s better to be proactive the better

    okay, that’s my pitch, feel free to poke holes
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