Employment and Support Allowance (ESA)
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ESA Contribution and Income related

alun31alun31 Member Posts: 5 Listener
Hi
I applied for esa in 2011 after having to finish work due to my mental health and was awarded contribution based esa and support group. I have remained on this ever since but only recently became aware that there is also income related esa which would entitle me to an extra £15.90 edp plus other benefits as i am in the support group and always have been.
I have never had savings over £3000 or any other form of income or capital and i believe this information would have been provided to the dwp on my original application. So should i therefor have been assessed for income related esa at the time and if so be eligible to claim a back payment?

The more information i try and find about this the more confused i get. Surely when you apply for esa and fill out the forms with all your information regarding savings and income etc its up to the dwp to give you the correct benefit or so i thought

Replies

  • Pippa_AlumniPippa_Alumni Scope alumni Posts: 5,851 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi @alun31, and welcome to the community!

    Our benefits advisors receive a large volume of enquiries, however somebody will be in touch as soon as possible. In the meantime, it might be worth using an online benefits calculator to get a better idea of whether you may be entitled to income related ESA, as well as any other additional benefits. You might also like to have a look at Scope's information on ESA. Hopefully, somebody will be in touch soon to advise you on what your next step should be. Best of luck! 
  • steve51steve51 Member Posts: 7,175 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi @alun31

    Good afternoon & welcome aboard.

    I’m so sorry to hear that you are unsure about your benefits. 

    1. We we have got lots of info on “ESA”

    2. We have also got “Benefit Advisors” here on our website.

    I’m very happy in helping / supporting you in which ever route you want to go down????

    Many thanks.
  • alun31alun31 Member Posts: 5 Listener
    Hi Pippa and Steve, many thanks for the kind welcome and replies. I have checked on a few benefits calculators and they all say i am entitled to the income related. I will be most appreciative of any advice from one of the benefits advisors when they have time and i will take it from there

    many thanks
    Alun
  • CockneyRebelCockneyRebel Member Posts: 5,257 Disability Gamechanger
    Hello alun and welcome

    Normally a claim for ESA (IR) requires filling in a financial check form ESA3. It would be worth while getting a full benefit check and help with your claim from CAB if possible

    CR
    Be all you can be, make  every day count. Namaste
  • BenefitsTrainingCoBenefitsTrainingCo Member Posts: 2,692 Pioneering

    Hi @Alun31

    The ESA1 form (which is the claim form you completed at the very start of your claim) asks for the information for both income based and contributions based benefit. The form asks you to indicate which type of benefit you are claiming and then only directs you to complete the parts relevant - therefore if you stated you wanted to make a contributions-based claim, the form would not ask you for details of savings etc.

    So your case for backdate will come down to what you asked for on that original form - which I'm guessing (since it was 2011) you can't remember.

    Tactically therefore, I'd be doing two things - firstly, get an ESA3 form as CR suggests and get the additional premium added on at least as of now, and secondly, sending a letter to ESA along the lines of "I believe that I claimed income based ESA in 2011 and that due to an error this has never been processed. Please review this decision and add the income related ESA from the start..." and just see what they come back with - they should still have a copy of the form, so I imagine they'll be quick enough to tell you if no claim for income related was made.

    Let us know how you get on!

    Kind regards,

    Mary

    The Benefits Training Co:
    Paul Bradley
    Michael Chambers
    Will Hadwen
    Sarah Hayle
    Maria Solomon
    David Stickland
  • alun31alun31 Member Posts: 5 Listener
    Thank you for your help, i will ring them now to send me an ESA3 form and also ask them to send me a copy of the original ESA1 form i sent to see exactly what i put down on it. I will keep you informed of how things go

    Alun
  • alun31alun31 Member Posts: 5 Listener
    Hi
    I phoned dwp yesterday and asked about having the enhanced disability benefit added to my esa as an income related amount and was told you can not have any income related amounts or top ups applied if you are on contribution based esa only change to fully income related. I believe this is wrong as it clearly states on the gov.uk site that income related is either paid on its own or on top of contribution based if on low income?

    I then asked why i was on contribution esa in the first place as i would have always qualified for the ir esa to which she said it was on their system as a contribution only claim and this was always paid before ir anyway. I then asked for them to send me a copy of the original esa 1 form i sent as i was sure i applied for both ir and cb esa, to which she replied i dont think we will have the forms but i can have a look.

    Something i came across while searching for information was a caselaw which the judge ruled that esa was a single benefit and not two seperate benefits so the dwp should assess whether a claim is qualifying for ir esa as well as cb even if the claimant only asks for one or the other
    http://www.osscsc.gov.uk/Aspx/view.aspx?id=4349

    Para 12. ... it is not necessary to make separate claims for each of the contributory allowance and the income-related allowance. ... there is nothing in the legislation requiring separate claims for the contributory allowance and the income-related allowance.

    Para 13. As a matter of practice, a claimant is given an opportunity on a standard claim form to indicate whether he or she wishes to “claim” both allowances or only one of them.

    That has obvious administrative advantages for the Department and it also has advantages for claimants – provided that they do not wrongly believe that they are not entitled to one or other of the allowances – because it avoids delay while contribution records are investigated or, probably more importantly, makes it unnecessary for a claimant to provide details of his or her financial position.

    Nonetheless, despite the language usually used, an indication that one or other of the allowances is not “claimed” amounts to a waiver of the need for the Secretary of State to consider entitlement to that element of employment and support allowance, rather than amounting to a true failure to claim it.

    The legislation does not actually contemplate there being a claim for only one element of the allowance.

    Para 25. ... the amount of employment and support allowance may include an amount attributable to the income-related allowance without a specific claim for that allowance having been made"

    So where i go from here i dont know
  • BenefitsTrainingCoBenefitsTrainingCo Member Posts: 2,692 Pioneering

    Hi @Alun31

    Firstly, I'm loving that judgement!! I'll admit I was not aware of it - apologies - but seems it may certainly be of use to you.

    Secondly, as regards adding the premium now, I think the person you have spoken to at the DWP has failed to understand what you are on about. Let's not forget that they are callcentre staff and not decision makers and therefore have limited knowledge of the benefits system. I hope that they sent you an ESA3 anyway and that you have completed it? If not you need to call them back and ask for one - no need to go into too much detail as to what it is for.

    Thirdly, as regards the original claim form, if it doesn't seem to be forthcoming, I would recommend putting something in writing to the DWP. Entitle it something to the effect of 'Any Time Review Request' and mention that you believe that the income based element has been omitted from your claim due to an error on the part of the DWP - work on the assumption that you believe you did tick 'both', but perhaps add a  bit about this case at the end, that even if it were the case that 'both' had not been ticked, it would still have been an error on their part not to consider your entitlement to the income-related part.

    Don't be put off!

    Let us know how you're getting on.

    Kind regards,

    Mary

    The Benefits Training Co:
    Paul Bradley
    Michael Chambers
    Will Hadwen
    Sarah Hayle
    Maria Solomon
    David Stickland
  • alun31alun31 Member Posts: 5 Listener
    Thanks for your reply Mary, i am still waiting for the ESA3 to arrive but no surprise there!!
    I will keep you informed of any developments along the way which may in turn help others in a similar position

    Alun
  • wilkowilko Member Posts: 2,294 Disability Gamechanger
    When i applied for ESA I had my PIP accessment, and on phoning about transport for my ESA accessment was informed I have been put in the surport group without accessment. The award was for both income and contributed ESA.
  • Al_leisterAl_leister Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Alun31, I'm really keen to know what the outcome was; I'm in the same situation and wondering if I can claim IB ESA top up?
    Thank you 
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Member Posts: 22,218 Disability Gamechanger
    Alun31, I'm really keen to know what the outcome was; I'm in the same situation and wondering if I can claim IB ESA top up?
    Thank you 
    Hi,

    That will depend what ESA you're currently claiming, whether it's the old Contributions based or the New style ESA.

    If it's the old Contributions based then claiming the IR top up is possible but it will totally depend on your circumstances.

    If it's new style ESA then there's no IR top up paid on this.
    Proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice I have given to members here on the community.
  • Al_leisterAl_leister Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Thanks, Poppy. 
    It is old style CB esa, both my wife and me. 
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Member Posts: 22,218 Disability Gamechanger
    Thanks, Poppy. 
    It is old style CB esa, both my wife and me. 
    Are you claiming as a couple? Is your wife claiming any other benefits or working? Sorry but it's impossible to help without all the information. If you don't want to disclose any information then you will need to speak to an advice agency near you for a full benefits check.
    Proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice I have given to members here on the community.
  • Al_leisterAl_leister Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Hi Poppy 
    I claimed esa about a year after my wife. 
    Both on CB support group. 
    Both receive pip, lr daily living. 
    No savings, not receiving any other benefits/income. 
    Applied for Housing benefit, had to go through UC to claim. This was six months ago. Each month UC statement shows Zero. Advised not eligible for any other benefits due to total of our esa, £483.82 each. 
  • Adrian_ScopeAdrian_Scope Testing team Posts: 7,954

    Scope community team

    Hi @Al_leister and welcome to the community.

    Is your housing on your UC claim? Unless your housing is less than £132ish I feel like you should still be getting some Universal Credit.

    £498.89 Standard Couple rate age 25+
    £336.20 LCWRA
    = £835.09

    Then deduct £967.46 for CB ESA.

    Leaves -132.37 but if your rent is more than £132.37 a month then you should still be getting some UC. 
    Senior Community Partner
    Scope

    Your feedback is really important to the development of the online community, so please remember to complete our online community annual survey
  • Al_leisterAl_leister Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Thank you, Adrian 
    We initially claimed ESA. 
    Later we applied for Housing benefit and were advised we must submit a UC claim to receive HB so we did.
    Our UC statement shows £0 each month with the following information,
    £498.89 couple rate
    £289.64 rent (- rates) 
    Total £788.53
    There is no mention of UCWRA. 
    Thank you 
  • Al_leisterAl_leister Member Posts: 11 Listener
    We both are in support group. 
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Member Posts: 22,218 Disability Gamechanger
    Thank you, Adrian 
    We initially claimed ESA. 
    Later we applied for Housing benefit and were advised we must submit a UC claim to receive HB so we did.
    Our UC statement shows £0 each month with the following information,
    £498.89 couple rate
    £289.64 rent (- rates) 
    Total £788.53
    There is no mention of UCWRA. 
    Thank you 
    As you're in the Support Group then they should be adding the LCWRA element of £336 per month, this is where the error is. You need to either put a note on your journal asking for that element to be added or ring UC to speak to your case manager. They will owe you some backdated money from the date your claim started.

    You should also check what local housing allowance you should be claiming for your area to make sure that's correct. If it's just yourself and your partner you'll be entitled to the 1 bedroom rate. Check here. https://lha-direct.voa.gov.uk/

    Proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice I have given to members here on the community.
  • Al_leisterAl_leister Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Thank you for this information and for your time. 
    I will add this information to the journal. 
    Best regards 
  • Adrian_ScopeAdrian_Scope Testing team Posts: 7,954

    Scope community team

    Best of luck @Al_leister. This does mean you should be entitled to a small amount of Universal Credit as well so I hope you are able to get it sorted quickly.
    Please let us know how you get on or if we can help in any way. 
    Senior Community Partner
    Scope

    Your feedback is really important to the development of the online community, so please remember to complete our online community annual survey
  • Al_leisterAl_leister Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Again, thank you for all your help. The amounts Adrian advised are now being paid including a back payment. After deductions we will receive £157 per month more than before.
    When I previously called the helpline that advises what benefits you are entitled to they wrongly  advised we were receiving all we were due. CRAZY
    THANK YOU SCOPE 
  • Chloe_ScopeChloe_Scope Scope Posts: 10,652 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi @Al_leister, I'm so glad things have worked out for you! 
    Community Partner
    Scope

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  • Adrian_ScopeAdrian_Scope Testing team Posts: 7,954

    Scope community team

    I've just spotted this @Al_leister. I'm so happy for you! I'm really glad you're now getting what you're entitled to and we were able to help you with it. :)
    Senior Community Partner
    Scope

    Your feedback is really important to the development of the online community, so please remember to complete our online community annual survey
  • Al_leisterAl_leister Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Thanks, Adrian 
    It's a shame the government advice line can't give this information to people when they ask what they are entitled to:we are new to this so learning as we go.
    Will now enquire about ESA income related top up as we may be able to receive help with dental and eye care costs. 
    Best regards 
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Member Posts: 22,218 Disability Gamechanger
    edited October 2019
    Thanks, Adrian 
    It's a shame the government advice line can't give this information to people when they ask what they are entitled to:we are new to this so learning as we go.
    Will now enquire about ESA income related top up as we may be able to receive help with dental and eye care costs. 
    Best regards 
    You won’t be able to  claim any more ESA on top of the contributions based you’re already receiving. This is because you’re claiming UC and this will be your top up because you’re receiving the LCWRA in with your monthly amount.

    You will be able to claim free NHS treatment for dental, eye tests and prescriptions because you’re claiming UC with no earned income. Hope this helps. 
    Proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice I have given to members here on the community.
  • Adrian_ScopeAdrian_Scope Testing team Posts: 7,954

    Scope community team

    Hi @Al_leister, as Poppy said you should be able to claim free NHS treatment as your earned income is below the threshold. At the bottom of your UC statement there should be a button that says 'Other support you may be able to get'. If you press that it will come up with a section showing your earned income in an assessment period and a table like the one I've copied below which will show you what you're entitled to in your situation.



    Senior Community Partner
    Scope

    Your feedback is really important to the development of the online community, so please remember to complete our online community annual survey
  • Al_leisterAl_leister Member Posts: 11 Listener
    Thank you for this, Adrian. 
  • Adrian_ScopeAdrian_Scope Testing team Posts: 7,954

    Scope community team

    No problem @Al_leister, I hope it's helped. :)
    Senior Community Partner
    Scope

    Your feedback is really important to the development of the online community, so please remember to complete our online community annual survey
  • Al_leisterAl_leister Member Posts: 11 Listener
    The service provided by Scope is, without doubt, priceless and a moral imperative in the current political economic climate.
    I hope Scope receive sufficient funding and donations to allow this great work to continue. 

    Best regards 
  • Chloe_ScopeChloe_Scope Scope Posts: 10,652 Disability Gamechanger
    This is so lovely to hear @Al_leister, thank you!
    Community Partner
    Scope

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  • Adrian_ScopeAdrian_Scope Testing team Posts: 7,954

    Scope community team

    Thank you @Al_leister, we really appreciate the feedback and I'm glad we've been able to help with your queries.
    Senior Community Partner
    Scope

    Your feedback is really important to the development of the online community, so please remember to complete our online community annual survey
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