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The dwp how you don’t stand a chance

BomfBomf Member Posts: 4 Listener
edited October 2018 in PIP, DLA and AA
I recently had my pip claim denied when I phoned them and asked who they wrote to or called about my condition I was told it was confidential so I pressed a little harder and was told they would have wrote to them if you were in hospital so I said to them you had no interest in contacting any one and after a while they admitted that they don’t contact anyone and you have to send your own proof in they want you to believe you don’t have a case when you probably do I’m at tribunal stage now my advice is don’t let rejection put you of tribunal is the only way you will get it

Replies

  • Ami2301Ami2301 Community champion Posts: 7,147 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi @Bomf welcome to the community!

    Sorry to hear what has happened. Please let us know if you need any help preparing for your tribunal! :)
    Community Champion
    Disability Gamechanger - 2019
  • lazlaz Member Posts: 7 Listener
    good luck at your tribunal! Laz. 
  • LiamO_DellLiamO_Dell Member Posts: 1,114 Pioneering
    Hi @Bomf,

    Welcome to Scope's online community! It's great to have you here. :)

    Best of luck with your tribunal - do let us know how it goes!
    Liam
  • YadnadYadnad Member - under moderation Posts: 2,862 Disability Gamechanger
    Bomf said:
    I’m at tribunal stage now my advice is don’t let rejection put you of tribunal is the only way you will get it
    It really depends on the strength of character and self will of the claimant. Not all claimants have that. I agree going to a Tribunal is a good idea, but don't make it an absolute requirement. Claimants have to decide for themselves if they are capable of that action.
  • BomfBomf Member Posts: 4 Listener
    I completely agree it’s made me stressed and even throw up during the process I even wondered if it’s worth all the agro I don’t cope with stress very well so Don’t make yourself ill over it but know your rights to be heard fairly if you are up to it 
  • debbiedo49debbiedo49 Member Posts: 2,906 Disability Gamechanger
    You never know if you don’t try but of course only you will know if it’s worth it. I’m lucky I had support. I just went into auto pilot 
    💜🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿
    I am a fibro warrior !💜♏️
  • judy21judy21 Member Posts: 18 Connected
    My pip got refused I didn’t even get one point and she made all her assembly whilst I was sat on
    a
    sofa 
  • BomfBomf Member Posts: 4 Listener
    I didn’t get one point either and the same on the mandatory so I decided to gather any evidence I could and have a paper tribunal not well enough to attend 
  • judy21judy21 Member Posts: 18 Connected
    Think it’s terrible that you have to go through all this doesit go against you if you don’t attend
  • BomfBomf Member Posts: 4 Listener
    I’ve been told you’re more likely to get it if you attend but I’m just taking a chance
  • YadnadYadnad Member - under moderation Posts: 2,862 Disability Gamechanger
    You never know if you don’t try but of course only you will know if it’s worth it. I’m lucky I had support. I just went into auto pilot 
    Yes you were lucky. Many have never had any help from the start of the claiming process - they have just muddled through the best way they can hoping that they have done everything right.
  • judy21judy21 Member Posts: 18 Connected
    I have appealed will have to wait and see I guess 
  • debbiedo49debbiedo49 Member Posts: 2,906 Disability Gamechanger
    @Yadnad once again the voice of doom maybe we should all just give up and not even try and just let the DWP and tories win,. At every turn you are putting people off. Why are you on this forum ?
    💜🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿
    I am a fibro warrior !💜♏️
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,351 Disability Gamechanger
    When you claim the onus is on you to prove entitlement not the DWP. They gather evidence in limited circumstances laid out in their PIP assessment providers guidance which is available online. 

    71% of PIP appeals are won but the figure for paper hearings falls to single figures. You improve your chances if you have a rep who can assess and/or make a case on your behalf but bear in mind that even when you elect for a paper hearing a tribunal have to decide if that’s appropriate and may adjourn anyway and ask you to attend. 
  • debbiedo49debbiedo49 Member Posts: 2,906 Disability Gamechanger
    I wasn't going to go either but due to the advice and support on here I went for it. I think tribunals are different as they are independent. They try to put you at ease so don't worry about the stress. It's not as bad as the assessment. Just prepare for it. Good luck
    💜🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿
    I am a fibro warrior !💜♏️
  • debbiedo49debbiedo49 Member Posts: 2,906 Disability Gamechanger
    I wasn't going to go either but due to the advice and support on here I went for it. I think tribunals are different as they are independent. They try to put you at ease so don't worry about the stress. It's not as bad as the assessment. Just prepare for it. Good luck
    💜🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿
    I am a fibro warrior !💜♏️
  • tommtomm Member Posts: 231 Pioneering
    Tribunals are no magic bullet As some of them have their own agendas,But if you have good medical evidence that backs up your claim  and have been consistent in what you have told them, from completing the application form, @ the assessment /MR then you shouldn't have any issues
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,351 Disability Gamechanger
    What does a tribunal having their own agenda mean? 
  • YadnadYadnad Member - under moderation Posts: 2,862 Disability Gamechanger
    @Yadnad once again the voice of doom maybe we should all just give up and not even try and just let the DWP and tories win,. At every turn you are putting people off. Why are you on this forum ?
    To help! Surely it is better to give the good news as well as the bad - yes?

    I read on nearly every thread advice telling posters that they must get help from the likes of the CAB or Welfare Rights. that's good, but how do you think a poster would feel if they can't access that help? Deflated I would expect in that they might as well give up there and then as without that level of help they probably haven't got a chance in hell!

    I point out that they are not alone, many, who have never filled in a PIP claim form before do actually try their best. They may make mistakes or even give the DWP good reason, but for the wrong reasons to keep on re-assessing them. They don't need to worry if they have no idea what they are doing or don't handle the face to face assessment in the right manner or fail to provide any evidence - they try.

    Unfortunately the sad fact is that that sector of society will probably fail in their attempt in making a claim - but at least they have tried.

    Don't make people worry if they have no one to assist them - they are not alone, they are the unlucky ones, and are with others in the same boat.

  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,351 Disability Gamechanger
    I think the point being made is that the point at which to let people know they’re not alone is maybe IF they’ve failed to secure advice rather than before they’ve even tried. Do people talk about their terrible accident when someone is learning to drive? 
  • YadnadYadnad Member - under moderation Posts: 2,862 Disability Gamechanger
    I agree and I am not suggesting that people give up at the first hurdle. I won't reiterate my experiences of these agencies, but I have tried everyone in the area.
    Some are so bad that I had to cover up their inadequacies at a Tribunal when the judge asked me who on earth had filled out the claim form.

    Then I have stood in the pouring rain for an hour one morning outside the CAB office waiting to see someone only to be told that it was the first 6 that would be allowed in - come back and try again tomorrow I was told. 

    I did go back and was allowed in the following day. They took my name and the reason for my visit and was tole that someone would be in contact to get me to come back - I never heard anything more from them.

    So yes try to get help but don't be down  hearted if you fail to get it.
  • debbiedo49debbiedo49 Member Posts: 2,906 Disability Gamechanger
    @Yadnad thanks to Scope I found out that there’s are also other ways to get help with the pip process or other DWP processes through using the internet and accessing sites that provide the info. That can make a big difference. Also through my own experience I know that there are charitable organisations that can help within local areas as people are struggling with the process and may need specific support such as mental health like myself. Not everyone knows about that and I try to promote it to help others. Both of these things can be very helpful. My dad passed away suddenly in May and I had my pip tribunal in June. Do I bring that up every time I talk about my experience? No I do not. Scope was there for me when I needed it and that’s all people need to know. You can succeed if you get help from Scope and other sites with or without other physical representation. It is not helpful to encourage folks to give up when they just feel like giving up. With a little encouragement folks can feel uplifted and find the strength to carrying on. 
    💜🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿
    I am a fibro warrior !💜♏️
  • YadnadYadnad Member - under moderation Posts: 2,862 Disability Gamechanger
    @Yadnad thanks to Scope I found out that there’s are also other ways to get help with the pip process or other DWP processes through using the internet and accessing sites that provide the info. That can make a big difference. Also through my own experience I know that there are charitable organisations that can help within local areas as people are struggling with the process and may need specific support such as mental health like myself. Not everyone knows about that and I try to promote it to help others. Both of these things can be very helpful. My dad passed away suddenly in May and I had my pip tribunal in June. Do I bring that up every time I talk about my experience? No I do not. Scope was there for me when I needed it and that’s all people need to know. You can succeed if you get help from Scope and other sites with or without other physical representation. It is not helpful to encourage folks to give up when they just feel like giving up. With a little encouragement folks can feel uplifted and find the strength to carrying on. 
    And you trust websites to give factually correct information? Then don't bother with the CAB one for instance. Twice in the past few weeks advice offered is found to be at best misleading and at worst dangerous.

    And as Mike Hughes and others say at regular intervals - getting good face to face advice is the best way to deal with problems.
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,351 Disability Gamechanger
    There are a few sites to be trusted but they all provide information, which is very different to advice.
  • debbiedo49debbiedo49 Member Posts: 2,906 Disability Gamechanger
    @Yadnad honestly you could start an argument in an empty room. Scope mentions web sites regularly on here for different benefits. Stop making this all about your experience please
    💜🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿
    I am a fibro warrior !💜♏️
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,351 Disability Gamechanger
    Some people only have their own experience to bring to the table. In the bigger picture that can be wholly misleading - I won by doing this so should should do it too. I couldn’t access that so be warned that you might not be able to etc. - but it’s still their experience. I doubt there’s a post in here that isn’t about someone’s own experience. So, maybe comment on the post not the poster as we’re constantly reminded! I have issue with the timing of some posts - people need to know they’re not alone if they can’t secure face to face advice. They don’t need to know how bad it was for other people before they’ve even had the chance to seek any - but that remains a personal view. 

    FWIW the decline in face to face advice has seen an inevitable rise in web information to fill the void but infirmation is not advice. They are hugely different and, for example, I am aware professionally that many popular web sites offer poor information no matter who they’re recommended by.
  • simon_cutsimon_cut Member Posts: 13 Listener
    dont give up buddy so many people are going through the same !! the system has to change in my opinion !!
  • debbiedo49debbiedo49 Member Posts: 2,906 Disability Gamechanger
    When someone repeatedly responds to posts quoting their own negative experiences when folks are coming here for help support it’s not on. The timing is poor. I think I would prefer solutions not negativity. The constant negativity is really hard to observe and I think it’s inappropriate. I get frustrated and try to get the person to understand the damage they could cause but it is not working. I wish Scope would intervene. No wonder people leave. 


    💜🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿
    I am a fibro warrior !💜♏️
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,351 Disability Gamechanger
    I agree but, again, it’s about their timing not the person. 
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Member Posts: 22,218 Disability Gamechanger
    @debbiedo49 There's options under each comment, under the flag option you can also report a comment if you think it's not appropriate. Click on it, give your reasons why you thinks it's not appropriate and scope will take a look. If they agree with you, then the comment will be removed.

    Failing that then there's also the ignore option. This works well for those that annoy you. Doing this, you won't see their comments but they will see yours.
    Community champion and proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice i have given to members here on the community.
  • AKHAKH Member Posts: 8 Listener
    Bomf said:
    I recently had my pip claim denied when I phoned them and asked who they wrote to or called about my condition I was told it was confidential so I pressed a little harder and was told they would have wrote to them if you were in hospital so I said to them you had no interest in contacting any one and after a while they admitted that they don’t contact anyone and you have to send your own proof in they want you to believe you don’t have a case when you probably do I’m at tribunal stage now my advice is don’t let rejection put you of tribunal is the only way you will get it

  • AKHAKH Member Posts: 8 Listener
    Don’t give up, my adult daughter on high rate DLA scored 4 points over the whole pip assessment - assessor wasn’t remotely interested in anything we was telling her. 8 months later we finally get into appeal hearing and was granted enhanced rate pip on both levels for 5 years.  Daughter has cerebral palsy and many other problems. Awful had to go thro all this and pleased they have to now back pay it all. How someone with no knowledge of your medical history can assess you from sitting on a chair for 20 min and conclude so wrongly is disgusting .. fight it ! I have to say the appeal panel - judge, doctor and disability anazist were very nice to her far nicer than the original assessor was. It should be the three people on appeal panels doing the first assessment and making the decision in the first place. No one person who knows nothing and not interested other than hitting targets 
  • PhantomscriptPhantomscript Member Posts: 10 Listener
    For many the pot holed maze DWP runs you through is gut wrenching. Just reach out and you will get support
  • AKHAKH Member Posts: 8 Listener
    I agree it is, and it’s made me ill and I’m not the disabled one just her appointee ..my daughter could never have got thro the paperwork and forms for that without me doing it all, no consideration is given to how difficult the process is for someone with a disability in the first place. We’ve had a good outcome finally but I’m still so angry about the original assessor that’s put us through this. I will refuse to ever let my daughter be assessed at that assessment centre again, I’d rather drive 100 miles to another one but everyone seems to be saying the same thing about it, time they  started listening or reading this website we can’t all be wrong ! 
  • AKHAKH Member Posts: 8 Listener
    Can I just add for anyone about to appeal etc, when I was called back in and told the result I asked the judge and doctor if it’s likely I’ve got to go thro this on every renew claim.. they said the best thing you can produce to the assessor and the appeal panel if you have to go that far is an occupational therapist report, which I did have at appeal but not at the point of first assessment. I asked GP for a referral to a nurological rehabilitation team for my daughter and they have reports from OT, physio, dietitian where they had assessed my
    daughter in her own home. I think the view is the reason so many appeals are won is because claimants produce much more medical reports at appeal stage than they produced at assessment stage which I have to admit was also the case for us 
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,351 Disability Gamechanger
    DWP repeatedly, and wrongly, suggest to Parliament that most appeals win because of new medical evidence at the appeal stage. It’s nonsense. Most appeals win on pretty much the evidence put in with a claim. Equally though the tribunal advice is not necessarily true. If you want a longer award then the single most important thing you can do is to raise the length of the award at the claim stage in the “Anything else you’d like to tell us” section. 
  • AKHAKH Member Posts: 8 Listener
    No Mike,nothing else other than...  I was trying to make people feel that appealing is a possitive way to go, to not be afraid of it, go armed, be prepared and don’t go paper based unless you really really have to. I’ve not had an one single ounce of advise from any organisation in the whole process nor have I google anything or looked on websites. people need to take faith they are telling the truth and the truth can always be proven and the truth will always come out on top in the end.  But, I’m not a negative argumentative person with any interest in putting other people down . 

    Keep fighting girls and guys x 
  • judy21judy21 Member Posts: 18 Connected
    I applied in July still waiting assememt done said nothing wrong no problems looked well and happy all completely wrong I actually thought the report was on someone else by the things she had written they are looking over it again at the moment 
  • cristobalcristobal Member Posts: 965 Disability Gamechanger
    I became very suspicious at the end of my assessment when I asked if I could look at the notes that the assessor had made on her laptop. I was told that I wasn't allowed to, and that she had told me what had been written anyway. 

    Curiously when I received a copy of the report and challenged it's contents I was told that the notes had been destroyed.
  • WaylayWaylay Member Posts: 916 Pioneering
    @AKH Please consider making complaints to ATOS/Capita, the assessor's registration body, and the DWP.
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,351 Disability Gamechanger
    I’ve no doubt few people get wholly accurate HCP reports but where does this idea you have a right to see what has been written come from? When you go to your GP or a consultant do you demand to see what they’ve written? A HCP is giving their view. They’ve not their to wholly reflect your own view of your functional impairment. It would be a pointless step if they were.
  • cristobalcristobal Member Posts: 965 Disability Gamechanger
    Mike - perhaps I didn't make my point very well.

    An assessor will have their own opinions and, after all, you can't really be wrong about what your opinion is!

    However If the assessor asks, "Can you walk from A to B" and the answer is "No I can't" then this should be recorded accurately. The assessor can say "He says he can't walk from A to b but I think that he can and he's lying/ mistaken" -  that's fine - it's their opinion. What they can't do is change the answer to "Yes i can walk from A to B" because this is a lie. Dishonest. Fabrication.

    When I asked to see the notes what I wanted to do was check their accuracy - not for opinion but matters of fact. I did this because the assessor's interview technique,using leading questions, failing to follow up my answers, and constantly summarising what I was saying incorrectly, etc left me with grave doubts as to her honesty. 

    The end result is as I have previously posted - numerous (probably more than 20 although I've not counted) lies. The fact that i wasn't allowed to look at them, and that they have now apparently been "destroyed" (I know for a fact that haven't) makes the whole process look increasingly dishonest.

    Your opinions and advice are very valuable Mike. However your posts always seem to be doubting what i say and you don't seem to accept that, in my case, the assessment was carried out completely dishonestly.

    Curiously I can't work out why....


  • cristobalcristobal Member Posts: 965 Disability Gamechanger
    To clarify "I can't work out why" refers to the assessment provider's dishonesty tot you Mike!

  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,351 Disability Gamechanger
    The issue for me is as follows:

    1 - there are hundreds of threads on here saying the same as you. There is little doubt assessors do as you say and I’m struggling to think where I’ve challenged  you on any aspect of that. The lack of a search function on this forum means that this and related issues come back again and again and the answers have to be repeated. 

    2 - much of what you say is based on both a misunderstanding of the role of the HCP and the software they’re using. Let’s take the example from your third paragraph. When the assessor is asking the question their role is not to write down your answer verbatim. If that was their role having a HCP assessment would be pointless because, unless your evidence was inconsistent, it would never do anything other than reproduce what you put in your claim pack. 

    They ask a question. You give an answer. They need to weigh that answer against what’s in your claim pack; their assessment on the day and any other evidence in their possession. Let’s put aside for a second that much of the latter clearly rarely happens. 

    If their view is that your answer isn’t suppprted by what they know or are seeing then they write down a different answer. Now, here’s the thing. The report is electronic. They have to select from specific options and they only get a small drop down to add notes. If your answer or their view doesn’t fit those drop downs they select the nearest. There are numerous ways in which this goes wrong and also doesn’t comply with PIP legislation but again let’s leave that to one side. 

    The bottom line is that the option of saying “they say this but I think that” isn’t actually always available in the form you describe or assume. So, often we conclude they’re hateful liars when in fact they’re trying to fit a square peg into a round hole using American designed software originally used for insurance and slanted towards saying “no”. 

    Great article on that re: ESA and the WCA at https://www.centreforwelfarereform.org/uploads/attachment/618/preventable-harm-and-the-work-capability-assessment.pdf.

    3 - I don’t know what notes you think there were other than what they input on screen. I’ve yet to have a single client report that the HCP took notes separate to what they were inputting. I very much doubt they’d have the time for that but there are always new angles on this so I stand to be corrected. However, even if they did, those notes have no formal standing and should rightly be destroyed ASAP. There are some circumstances where notes do have legal standing, such as a tribunal judges handwritten record of proceedings, but this isn’t one of them. 

    4 - Bottom line always remains the same. When it comes to tribunals you’re usually kicking at an open door as regards HCP reports but to focus wholly on the report is the wrong approach. All a tribunal can do is give less weight to the report. They don’t really care whether there was 1 error or 20 or whether it was a mistake or dishonesty. You can still therefore lose your case if the weight of your evidence is not sufficient to outweigh the HCP report, discredited or otherwise. 
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,351 Disability Gamechanger
    cristobal said:
    To clarify "I can't work out why" refers to the assessment provider's dishonesty tot you Mike!

    Hahaha. I wasn’t sure but thank you for clarifying :)
  • judy21judy21 Member Posts: 18 Connected
    The lady who came to me wrote completely dodgerng to how the situation was and added parts I have rang tjem
    about this and the lady on the phone actually said we are hearing a lot of this lately 
  • YadnadYadnad Member - under moderation Posts: 2,862 Disability Gamechanger
    edited December 2018
    I’ve no doubt few people get wholly accurate HCP reports but where does this idea you have a right to see what has been written come from? When you go to your GP or a consultant do you demand to see what they’ve written? A HCP is giving their view. They’ve not their to wholly reflect your own view of your functional impairment. It would be a pointless step if they were.
    When I see (rarely these days) my GP, diabetic nurse or even the asthma nurse, you always sit at the side of the desk and can see what is being written. On top of that the GP actually reads out loud what he has reported just to make sure that he has captured everything.

  • Delboy1234Delboy1234 Member Posts: 6 Listener
    Bomf said:
    I recently had my pip claim denied when I phoned them and asked who they wrote to or called about my condition I was told it was confidential so I pressed a little harder and was told they would have wrote to them if you were in hospital so I said to them you had no interest in contacting any one and after a while they admitted that they don’t contact anyone and you have to send your own proof in they want you to believe you don’t have a case when you probably do I’m at tribunal stage now my advice is don’t let rejection put you of tribunal is the only way you will get it

  • cristobalcristobal Member Posts: 965 Disability Gamechanger
    @mikehughescq


    Thanks for your latest post.I’ll comment and then keep quiet as this is a bit too ‘me-related’ and I’m not sure it will help anyone (which isn’t my intention - I did think I would help when I first posted) The ‘notes’ that I referred to were typed into a laptop (most of the time anyway) 

    Your post, and the link, are very informative and answer a lot of questions. My interview (and as I said I do know something about interviewing) was designed only to find reasons why I shouldn’t get benefit rather than find out facts and this is obviously explained by the fact that it is computer driven. I accept what you say about drop down menus/best choice answer etc but it must be incredibly poor software if it pushes the interviewer into asking a closed question - “Can you do x?” and then recording Yes instead of No, or vice versa.

    I’m an honest person, and I don’t like people lying even if they are ‘only following orders’ (or a computer programme at least) The really crazy thing is that if the government want to save money then they don’t need to stitch people up - all that they need to do is change the criteria so that less people qualify. 

    I will be seeking your advice, and everyone else’s, when the DWP finally decide what to do about the assessment providers ‘clinical review’ which suggests I should get 44 points instead of 12.

    Obviously on the second occasion “the computer said Yes!”

    Thanks once again!

  • YadnadYadnad Member - under moderation Posts: 2,862 Disability Gamechanger
    cristobal said:
    @mikehughescq


    Thanks for your latest post.I’ll comment and then keep quiet as this is a bit too ‘me-related’ and I’m not sure it will help anyone (which isn’t my intention - I did think I would help when I first posted) The ‘notes’ that I referred to were typed into a laptop (most of the time anyway) 

    Your post, and the link, are very informative and answer a lot of questions. My interview (and as I said I do know something about interviewing) was designed only to find reasons why I shouldn’t get benefit rather than find out facts and this is obviously explained by the fact that it is computer driven. I accept what you say about drop down menus/best choice answer etc but it must be incredibly poor software if it pushes the interviewer into asking a closed question - “Can you do x?” and then recording Yes instead of No, or vice versa.

    I’m an honest person, and I don’t like people lying even if they are ‘only following orders’ (or a computer programme at least) The really crazy thing is that if the government want to save money then they don’t need to stitch people up - all that they need to do is change the criteria so that less people qualify. 

    I will be seeking your advice, and everyone else’s, when the DWP finally decide what to do about the assessment providers ‘clinical review’ which suggests I should get 44 points instead of 12.

    Obviously on the second occasion “the computer said Yes!”

    Thanks once again!

    As Mike has said, the software used started life in the USA by insurance companies when trying to find reasons why the claimant was not entitled to the protection afforded by the policy.
    It was banned eventually.

    ATOS then started using it over here on the new ESA programme.
    So yes the whole software is biased in favour of the DWP.

    I do actually feel sorry for some of the assessors in having to use such a heavily restrictive bit of software. They are actively discouraged in entering their own comments.
  • mikehughescqmikehughescq Member Posts: 5,351 Disability Gamechanger
    Ah, those “notes” are the actual form filling and, yes, it’s software which is completely unfit for purpose.
  • justg72justg72 Member Posts: 173 Pioneering
    Hi All
    I have been reading all the posts above and parts are about the computer software which is used in an assessment. Well all I can say is that this wasn't relevant in my assessment and all the other people who had their assessments that day because all the computers were down and your form and evidence wasn't available. So I scored 0 for both. I was told it doesn't matter if the computers are down! so this has opened my eyes on computer software and my score.  
  • judy21judy21 Member Posts: 18 Connected
    So does everyone score 0
  • poppy123456poppy123456 Member Posts: 22,218 Disability Gamechanger
    judy21 said:
    So does everyone score 0
    No, absolutely not. Lots of people claim PIP successfully first time without any problems. Trouble is we don't often hear about the good stories. Mostly on an internet forum you'll hear the bad. If someone has an award they're happy with they have no questions to ask, so we don't hear their story.
    Community champion and proud winner of the 2019 empowering others award. This award was given for supporting disabled people and their families for the benefit advice i have given to members here on the community.
  • justg72justg72 Member Posts: 173 Pioneering
    Hi cristobel
    I like it when people share their stories even if it is about themselves including yourself. This gives others on this forum support, life experiences and information they are looking for because some people can not access advice  etc because they are housebound or can not face asking for help! Please do not keep quiet you are a valuable member of scope and I like to read others stories.
    Hope you have a great christmas and a happy new year!

  • justg72justg72 Member Posts: 173 Pioneering
    Hi Judy21
    Just to answer your question scoring 0 is no not everybody get scores this my other PIP assessments I have been awarded enhanced rate for both. So it just shows that the HCP's do not always get it right and that there is inaccurate reports been written.
    Merry xmas and a happy new year 
  • judy21judy21 Member Posts: 18 Connected
    Ah ok my face to face report was
    nothing like if wad I actually tjought they had mixed my forms with someone else and scored 0 on everything just waiting for the review to come back Has been9 weeks 
  • justg72justg72 Member Posts: 173 Pioneering
    Hi Judy21
    I had the same experience as you my F2F assessment report was totally different. Questions were answered but was never asked I had taken a family member with me to the assessment as I do not go out by myself because of my epilepsy and when they read the report they said that there must be a mistake. They said that they were sat in a different assessment as what it states in the report is not true, they thought that they must have had the names mixed up and made a mistake. I am now going to a tribunal. I hope you get good news. 
    Merry xmas and a happy new year 
  • judy21judy21 Member Posts: 18 Connected
    They say they have abig backlog I applied July 1st think the way they handle it doesn’t help I’m so skint at the moment and couldn’t work mentally or phisically thank you for your help merry chritmas to you to 
  • cristobalcristobal Member Posts: 965 Disability Gamechanger
    judy21 said:
    So does everyone score 0
    No, absolutely not. Lots of people claim PIP successfully first time without any problems. Trouble is we don't often hear about the good stories. Mostly on an internet forum you'll hear the bad. If someone has an award they're happy with they have no questions to ask, so we don't hear their story.
    Well said Poppy. That applies to lots of things - people don't tend to give positive feedback as readily as negative. 

    Personally I make an effort to try and see the whole picture. My 'beef' has always been with the assessment provider and, it now seems, their dodgy software. I have never had anything less than great service from DWP whenever I have contacted them - and I've told them so......
  • YadnadYadnad Member - under moderation Posts: 2,862 Disability Gamechanger
    justg72 said:
    Hi All
    I have been reading all the posts above and parts are about the computer software which is used in an assessment. Well all I can say is that this wasn't relevant in my assessment and all the other people who had their assessments that day because all the computers were down and your form and evidence wasn't available. So I scored 0 for both. I was told it doesn't matter if the computers are down! so this has opened my eyes on computer software and my score.  
    It doesn't matter if the system is down, the report is eventually completed using the system. It may well be that it was written up on the system days or even a week later.



  • YadnadYadnad Member - under moderation Posts: 2,862 Disability Gamechanger
    edited December 2018
    judy21 said:
    So does everyone score 0
    No not at all. The greater percentage of PIP applicants actually receive an award. It may well be that the award offered falls below what the claimant expected. The claimant then has the choice to just accept it or ask for a MR/appeal.

    As poppy says - forums like this one gives a skewed view on it as most people on here, despite being in the minority of claimants, have had problems with their claim.

    As an example I have had 3 face to face assessments for PIP in the past 5 years and all three came back with 0 points. But you must remember that people like me, you etc, are in the minority.
  • judy21judy21 Member Posts: 18 Connected
    Well awaiting results of review 🤞
  • justg72justg72 Member Posts: 173 Pioneering
    Hi Yadnad
    My report was written when the computers were down as I have a letter stating this. There are so many errors with the whole PIP process with myself from start to finish. The DWP even wrote to my MP and said that I had been awarded enhanced for care which was untrue. Theres many more errors so I think that I have been treat unfairly. Lets see what happens when I go to a tribunal, I have had people look at my case and have been told its very strong and I should win it, however I have lost faith in the whole system as the errors made in mine are unbelievable I have written proof. I have worked previously in a professional job in education until my health prevented me and all I can say is if I had made all these errors, I would have been sacked!
    Merry christmas and a happy new year!
  • YadnadYadnad Member - under moderation Posts: 2,862 Disability Gamechanger
    justg72 said:
    Hi Yadnad
    I have worked previously in a professional job in education until my health prevented me and all I can say is if I had made all these errors, I would have been sacked!
    I agree with you.
    I have been retired now for 10 years and worked both for the government as well as in private practice.
    If the standard of reporting in my day had been as shambolic as it is now, many heads would have rolled - either by way of a transfer out of the department, demotion or if that poor of standard was the norm then they would have been sacked as incapable of carrying out their duties.
    Unfortunately we live in a different world now where accuracy and taking responsibility for one's own actions has almost disappeared.

    If I had taken a written statement from an individual and it was full of these ridiculous errors that are happening now, I would have had the High Court demanding explanations.

    Even the Tribunals today seem to accept that the assessor reports are to be taken with a pinch of salt. Yet no one is being held to account. Result: carry on regardless as no one is really that bothered as to who says what and why.  

  • WaylayWaylay Member Posts: 916 Pioneering
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