I am worried about my pip assessment and suicide question

happyman

Has anyone been through the process and won or point me to a discussion on site that won

Government_needs_reform

@happymaan no one can wave a magic wand and or decide you get PIP. I've wrote you some useful information, just follow what Ive said starting with when you get the decision letter through and build your case for the Mandatory reconsideration.
I'm off to bed now. Take care as best as you can.

Here is a screenshot that I won for my PIP.

poppy123456

Hi,

You've had some really good advice from my friend @Government_needs_reform.

To add to that advice, you really should put the MR request in writing stating where you think you should have scored those points and your reasons why. Adding a couple of real life examples of what happened the last time you attempted that activity for each descriptor that applies to you.

I totally agree that mentioning any of the lies/contradictions in the report will not help your claim. DWP/Tribunal won't be interested in any of those. They will only be interested in where you think you should have scored those points.

Any complaints about the report should be sent to the health assessment providers, details how to do that will be on their website.

Evidence should be sent with the letter to support your claim because the onus is on you to make sure it's sent.

Only 18% of MR decisions change so you'll most likely have to take it to Tribunal. Appearing in person will give you the best chance of a decision in your favour. Waiting times for hearings are huge in most parts of the country and some are waiting as long as 1 year for a hearing date.

Having some understanding of the PIP descriptors and what they mean always helps because it's not always possible to score the points you think you should score.

For example, you say you need help getting to the toilet but this isn't included in this activity. For managing toilet needs what is considered is your ability to get on and off the toilet, to manage evacuation of the bladder and/or bowel and to clean afterwards.

This activity does not consider the ability to manage clothing, climb stairs or mobilise to the toilet.

Bathing, why do you need help with this? Do you need help to get into a bath? do you use aids to help you do this? If they think aids can reasonably be used, whether you use them or not then they will score you 2 points for needing an aid, rather than needing assistance. If you need assistance then you need to tell them why you need this and why using an aid will not be helpful to you.

Have a read of these links. https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/personal-independence-payment-assessment-guide-for-assessment-providers/pip-assessment-guide-part-2-the-assessment-criteria#daily-living-activities

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/personal-independence-payment-assessment-guide-for-assessment-providers/pip-assessment-guide-part-2-the-assessment-criteria#applying-the-criteria

happyman

Government_needs_reform said:

@happymaan no one can wave a magic wand and or decide you get PIP. I've wrote you some useful information, just follow what Ive said starting with when you get the decision letter through and build your case for the Mandatory reconsideration.
I'm off to bed now. Take care as best as you can.

Here is a screenshot that I won for my PIP.

was this after the tribunal, or when you asked for it to be looked at again

cristobal

@happyman - I'm sorry to hear what you have been going through.

As others have said you can ask for a mandatory reconsideration of the decision and to do this successfully you really do familiarise yourself with the information that is available on the links that Poppy has provided.

It helped me to look at it as though I were sitting an exam - so before I wrote anything I made certain that I understood exactly what the question was. Once I'd done this I avoided things that weren't relevant such as getting up and down stairs ('mobility' doesn't cover that), getting dried after a bath (not covered) etc..

Once you know what is involved in each area, go through methodically and give examples of what you can't do, whether you need assistance or aids etc.

Be specific - don't talk in general terms. So when you say that you can't cook be more detailed.

Cooking comes under 'preparing food' - essentially making a meal for one from fresh ingredients. Are you able to peel and chop? Do you need to sit down whilst you do it? Do you forget that you've left something on the stove? If you have then say what happened?
Was it dangerous?

You'll need to go through everything carefully so it will take some time - best to do a little bit each day so that it doesn't become overwhelming.

Finally don't forget that you are NOT on your own - there are plenty of people on this forum who will help you ...

happyman

i will follow the advice but, i cannot believe that someone is allowed to lie so much and nothing happens to them. this is shocking. i have read the report at least ten times and it was like they were talking about someone else. all the false information they put on there is shocking. i feel like going to my mp or something because this person should not be allowed to get away with this.

if this woman is not stopped then she will continue to tell lies on lots of other reports. this is so wrong

happyman

cristobal said:

@happyman - I'm sorry to hear what you have been going through.

As others have said you can ask for a mandatory reconsideration of the decision and to do this successfully you really do familiarise yourself with the information that is available on the links that Poppy has provided.

It helped me to look at it as though I were sitting an exam - so before I wrote anything I made certain that I understood exactly what the question was. Once I'd done this I avoided things that weren't relevant such as getting up and down stairs ('mobility' doesn't cover that), getting dried after a bath (not covered) etc..

Once you know what is involved in each area, go through methodically and give examples of what you can't do, whether you need assistance or aids etc.

Be specific - don't talk in general terms. So when you say that you can't cook be more detailed.

Cooking comes under 'preparing food' - essentially making a meal for one from fresh ingredients. Are you able to peel and chop? Do you need to sit down whilst you do it? Do you forget that you've left something on the stove? If you have then say what happened?
Was it dangerous?

You'll need to go through everything carefully so it will take some time - best to do a little bit each day so that it doesn't become overwhelming.

Finally don't forget that you are NOT on your own - there are plenty of people on this forum who will help you ...

thank you. i am rubbish at filling in forms and doing all this and that is what i am worried about. i have been told that going to c a b would be a waste of time. i just dont understand the lies on the report. she has put on there that i did things which i did not. she also put down that i successful did some tests that she did and i told her i couldnt. i have read alot about the mandoraty decision and it says that basically they just go in favour of the assessor.

Government_needs_reform

@happyman No it wasn't, I've never had to do a MR or an appeal ever, I stated my case through by filling all the PIP forms in and added all my evidence to backup everything I've said back on the posts above.

Im paralysed, amongst many other disabilities I have carers that look after me as I'm on my own. When I get good days I do campaigning now and a Labour Member.

I also advise you to read @poppy123456 has also stated above, she also has good knowledge of how the process works.

Chloe_Alumni

Hi @happyman, I'm sorry to hear about how untrue the report was, and I imagine this cannot have been nice to read! Poppy has attached some great information about the mandatory reconsideration, but please do let us know if there is anything else we can do to help.

Government_needs_reform

@happyman I'm gonna add one more thing here for you.

Please, please don't let it worry you, but I know it will? Forget about the lies it's happened, it wrong agree but you just need to build your case from this without saying she lied, get your family to help you with the forms if you can't manage it.

let the lies and untruths go it will only go against you. Let us know how you get on, good luck.

Chloe_Alumni

kensplace said:

SKipped past rest of thread just replying to o/p post.   

It most likely does not matter what you say, the assessor will lie anyway.  YOu might get lucky and get a honest one, but expect them to be scum and to lie and disregard what you say.

Re suicide - I once told my story to a assessor (missing a limb he was in case he is reading so he recognises himself) and he actually said to me if your life went so bad and things got so bad how come you did not kill yourself. Basically he did not believe I could be mentally ill as I was alive.....Thtas the sort of scum Im on about....

Dont worry. Just ask for the assessment to be recorded and expect a pack of lies to come through the post. If your lucky and its fine then all is well its a win. If not at least you expected the worst...... DO NOT TRUST THEM.  

Take a witness also.

Welcome to the community @kensplace, it's great to have you here.
I'm so sorry to read about how unfair the assessor was! 
Did you appeal the decision?

pollyanna1052

happyman said:

cristobal said:

@happyman - I'm sorry to hear what you have been going through.

As others have said you can ask for a mandatory reconsideration of the decision and to do this successfully you really do familiarise yourself with the information that is available on the links that Poppy has provided.

It helped me to look at it as though I were sitting an exam - so before I wrote anything I made certain that I understood exactly what the question was. Once I'd done this I avoided things that weren't relevant such as getting up and down stairs ('mobility' doesn't cover that), getting dried after a bath (not covered) etc..

Once you know what is involved in each area, go through methodically and give examples of what you can't do, whether you need assistance or aids etc.

Be specific - don't talk in general terms. So when you say that you can't cook be more detailed.

Cooking comes under 'preparing food' - essentially making a meal for one from fresh ingredients. Are you able to peel and chop? Do you need to sit down whilst you do it? Do you forget that you've left something on the stove? If you have then say what happened?
Was it dangerous?

You'll need to go through everything carefully so it will take some time - best to do a little bit each day so that it doesn't become overwhelming.

Finally don't forget that you are NOT on your own - there are plenty of people on this forum who will help you ...

thank you. i am rubbish at filling in forms and doing all this and that is what i am worried about. i have been told that going to c a b would be a waste of time. i just dont understand the lies on the report. she has put on there that i did things which i did not. she also put down that i successful did some tests that she did and i told her i couldnt. i have read alot about the mandoraty decision and it says that basically they just go in favour of the assessor.

Hi Happyman..I`ve read through this post and all it`s comments.
I am at the point where I`m awaiting the decision following my f2f on the 3rd Oct.

I see so often that we are advised to ask for a copy of their report. But I cant bear the thought of reading possible lie and then having to wait until the decision comes. I know it would completely do my head in. Like you, I simply cannot believe how these assessors lies are upheld. Why on earth is this allowed to continue? The government must know what`s going on. We teach our children to be honest, yet the highest office gets away with lying. It is totally wrong and goes against everything we were brought up with.

I feel so bad for you and worry that I may get the same treatment, despite needing huge amounts of help to live daily.

My best wishes to you and your family.

happyman

pollyanna1052 said:

happyman said:

cristobal said:

@happyman - I'm sorry to hear what you have been going through.

As others have said you can ask for a mandatory reconsideration of the decision and to do this successfully you really do familiarise yourself with the information that is available on the links that Poppy has provided.

It helped me to look at it as though I were sitting an exam - so before I wrote anything I made certain that I understood exactly what the question was. Once I'd done this I avoided things that weren't relevant such as getting up and down stairs ('mobility' doesn't cover that), getting dried after a bath (not covered) etc..

Once you know what is involved in each area, go through methodically and give examples of what you can't do, whether you need assistance or aids etc.

Be specific - don't talk in general terms. So when you say that you can't cook be more detailed.

Cooking comes under 'preparing food' - essentially making a meal for one from fresh ingredients. Are you able to peel and chop? Do you need to sit down whilst you do it? Do you forget that you've left something on the stove? If you have then say what happened?
Was it dangerous?

You'll need to go through everything carefully so it will take some time - best to do a little bit each day so that it doesn't become overwhelming.

Finally don't forget that you are NOT on your own - there are plenty of people on this forum who will help you ...

thank you. i am rubbish at filling in forms and doing all this and that is what i am worried about. i have been told that going to c a b would be a waste of time. i just dont understand the lies on the report. she has put on there that i did things which i did not. she also put down that i successful did some tests that she did and i told her i couldnt. i have read alot about the mandoraty decision and it says that basically they just go in favour of the assessor.

Hi Happyman..I`ve read through this post and all it`s comments.
I am at the point where I`m awaiting the decision following my f2f on the 3rd Oct.

I see so often that we are advised to ask for a copy of their report. But I cant bear the thought of reading possible lie and then having to wait until the decision comes. I know it would completely do my head in. Like you, I simply cannot believe how these assessors lies are upheld. Why on earth is this allowed to continue? The government must know what`s going on. We teach our children to be honest, yet the highest office gets away with lying. It is totally wrong and goes against everything we were brought up with.

I feel so bad for you and worry that I may get the same treatment, despite needing huge amounts of help to live daily.

My best wishes to you and your family.

Thank you. I have just come from an emergency appointment with you doctor. They have said they have shocked and if they started to contact the medical people looking after patient service thn they would get the real story. They have told me not to let it go and fight it. I am just worried about forms etc as I am no good at stuff like this 

pollyanna1052

I know hun....it is so stressful...but yes, do find the strength to fight on. I feel for you..really I do. xx I will fight mine if it comes down to it. xx

kensplace

Chloe_Scope said:

kensplace said:

SKipped past rest of thread just replying to o/p post.   

It most likely does not matter what you say, the assessor will lie anyway.  YOu might get lucky and get a honest one, but expect them to be scum and to lie and disregard what you say.

Re suicide - I once told my story to a assessor (missing a limb he was in case he is reading so he recognises himself) and he actually said to me if your life went so bad and things got so bad how come you did not kill yourself. Basically he did not believe I could be mentally ill as I was alive.....Thtas the sort of scum Im on about....

Dont worry. Just ask for the assessment to be recorded and expect a pack of lies to come through the post. If your lucky and its fine then all is well its a win. If not at least you expected the worst...... DO NOT TRUST THEM.  

Take a witness also.

Welcome to the community @kensplace, it's great to have you here.
I'm so sorry to read about how unfair the assessor was! 
Did you appeal the decision?

Thanks Chloe, yes I appealed, and eventually won.  In fact year after year I appealed and won as they did it over and over to me.. One year I lost the appeal as welfare rights "forgot" to turn up so it ended going to upper tribunal - I won that too.....   The horror stories I could tell...

kensplace

Government_needs_reform said:

kensplace said:

SKipped past rest of thread just replying to o/p post.   

It most likely does not matter what you say, the assessor will lie anyway.  YOu might get lucky and get a honest one, but expect them to be scum and to lie and disregard what you say.

Re suicide - I once told my story to a assessor (missing a limb he was in case he is reading so he recognises himself) and he actually said to me if your life went so bad and things got so bad how come you did not kill yourself. Basically he did not believe I could be mentally ill as I was alive.....Thtas the sort of scum Im on about....

Dont worry. Just ask for the assessment to be recorded and expect a pack of lies to come through the post. If your lucky and its fine then all is well its a win. If not at least you expected the worst...... DO NOT TRUST THEM.  

Take a witness also.

@kensplace As you've skipped the thread the OP has had and failed the PIP assessment. So maybe a good idea to keep up. ?

Struggle with reading whole theads like this as my blood boils when I remember the hell I went through with IB and ESA and even a pip claim.

Sometimes just reply to the o/p and come back later to read more.

happyman

kensplace said:

Chloe_Scope said:

kensplace said:

SKipped past rest of thread just replying to o/p post.   

It most likely does not matter what you say, the assessor will lie anyway.  YOu might get lucky and get a honest one, but expect them to be scum and to lie and disregard what you say.

Re suicide - I once told my story to a assessor (missing a limb he was in case he is reading so he recognises himself) and he actually said to me if your life went so bad and things got so bad how come you did not kill yourself. Basically he did not believe I could be mentally ill as I was alive.....Thtas the sort of scum Im on about....

Dont worry. Just ask for the assessment to be recorded and expect a pack of lies to come through the post. If your lucky and its fine then all is well its a win. If not at least you expected the worst...... DO NOT TRUST THEM.  

Take a witness also.

Welcome to the community @kensplace, it's great to have you here.
I'm so sorry to read about how unfair the assessor was! 
Did you appeal the decision?

Thanks Chloe, yes I appealed, and eventually won.  In fact year after year I appealed and won as they did it over and over to me.. One year I lost the appeal as welfare rights "forgot" to turn up so it ended going to upper tribunal - I won that too.....   The horror stories I could tell...

please share your experience

happyman

after sleeping on it i am not sure if i am going to appeal. I went to my doctors and they were shocked and disgusted. They said i need the help, but they are also worried about me being rejected. They said, all PIP need to do is to spend 24 hours with me and see the problems i face each day. They are concerned how it will affect my stress levels. The problem I have is, why appeal when i am not allowed to mention how many lies the assessor told, which includes saying i did tests which i refused to do. When a person reads my application form, and then reads my appeal, and then reads a so called professional (the assessor) they are going to and unstandably say well the assessor says he is fine, he did that test and did this test. i was perfectly fine. They are not going to go with my appeal are they. The pip assessor form should be a legal document where if it has false information on it then the person filling it in can be charged with the public office offence. My wife reduced her work hours by half so she could look after me, and my daughter gave up her promotion to look after me. I struggle with forms, so the way i feel at the moment is, what is the point in appealing. its a shame there was not a professional organisation who helps people with the appeal process. It is like these assessors get a bonus for lying and keeping people from getting help

happyman

kensplace said:

Chloe_Scope said:

kensplace said:

SKipped past rest of thread just replying to o/p post.   

It most likely does not matter what you say, the assessor will lie anyway.  YOu might get lucky and get a honest one, but expect them to be scum and to lie and disregard what you say.

Re suicide - I once told my story to a assessor (missing a limb he was in case he is reading so he recognises himself) and he actually said to me if your life went so bad and things got so bad how come you did not kill yourself. Basically he did not believe I could be mentally ill as I was alive.....Thtas the sort of scum Im on about....

Dont worry. Just ask for the assessment to be recorded and expect a pack of lies to come through the post. If your lucky and its fine then all is well its a win. If not at least you expected the worst...... DO NOT TRUST THEM.  

Take a witness also.

Welcome to the community @kensplace, it's great to have you here.
I'm so sorry to read about how unfair the assessor was! 
Did you appeal the decision?

Thanks Chloe, yes I appealed, and eventually won.  In fact year after year I appealed and won as they did it over and over to me.. One year I lost the appeal as welfare rights "forgot" to turn up so it ended going to upper tribunal - I won that too.....   The horror stories I could tell...

when you go to a pip assessment and vulnerable you don't expect to be asked why you have tried suicide yet 

poppy123456

No one said you weren’t actually allowed to mention the lies and contradictions in the report. What was advised was if you do mention them then it won’t help you because you can’t prove what did or didn’t happen.

You need to prove those descriptors apply to you and doing so will give you the best chance of a decision in your favour.

 A poorly presented case can often lead to refusal, which is why you were advised against mentioning those lies. 

The MR decision will most likely remain the same but appearing in person at your Tribunal hearing will give you the best chance of a decision in your favour.