Pip payment is odd. If they've stopped my claim, how soon will I have to return my motability car? — Scope | Disability forum
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Pip payment is odd. If they've stopped my claim, how soon will I have to return my motability car?

loracuk
loracuk Member Posts: 5 Listener
edited December 2021 in PIP, DLA, and AA
Hi all

i have been getting pip for the last three years and reapplied etc in august. I’ve not received any letters but this morning I’ve got an odd amount from them whtn my payment isn’t due until Tuesday.
Im now thinking they’ve stopped my claim and that’s the final decision payment. If they’ve stopped it how soon will I have to return my motability car? I live rurally so will be lost without it. 
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Comments

  • calcotti
    calcotti Member Posts: 3,765 Disability Gamechanger
    edited December 2021
    Until you know what the decision outcome is it’s pointless to speculate. The odd payment might be an arrears payment due because the award has been increased. Either ring them to find out or wait and see what payment you get on Tuesday.
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • loracuk
    loracuk Member Posts: 5 Listener
    Just spoken to them and they’ve stopped my higher mobility element so I’m going to lose my car. I’m so scared as I live in a village miles from my family and need transport. I will ask my gp to do me a letter to see if that help but any advice gratefully received. 
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Member Posts: 25,573 Disability Gamechanger
    Your next step will be to request the Mandatory Reconsideration (MR). Some information here, including a form to download and fill in. https://www.gov.uk/mandatory-reconsideration/how-to-ask-for-mandatory-reconsideration
    What you need to do is state where and why you think you should have scored those points. Adding a couple of real world examples of what happened the last time you attempted that activity for each descriptor that applies to you. Include information such as where you were, what exactly happened, did anyone see it and what the consequences were.
    A letter from your GP isn't the best evidence to send because they don't know exactly how your conditions affect you. They will only be able to state the basics like diagnosis, medication etc etc.
    Not only that they may charge for this letter.
    Motability will contact you regarding your car.
    Expert advice is also advised here. For this start here. https://advicelocal.uk] choose the topic "welfare benefits" and it will tell you what's local to you.



  • calcotti
    calcotti Member Posts: 3,765 Disability Gamechanger
    Information I post is for England unless otherwise stated. Rules may be different in other parts of UK.
  • racyguy
    racyguy Member Posts: 28 Listener
    This has and always has been my worry. Whilst I was given a 10 year award back in 2019, I cannot really understand how loracuk or indeed how anyone could have the mobility element removed if there were no changes in ability. Totally confused.

  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Member Posts: 25,573 Disability Gamechanger
    Different decision makers come to different conclusions. The majority of the time it's down to poorly completed claim packs.
  • mikehughescq
    mikehughescq Member Posts: 8,234 Disability Gamechanger
    edited January 1
    Can only echo @poppy123456 here. People endlessly assert how nothing has changed. There are two issues with that.

    1 - if you explore matters properly then something has almost always changed even if not sufficient to get more points. 

    2 - even if nothing relevant has changed, the form you complete is unlikely to have been identical to the last form you completed. Any evidence whether medical or anecdotal will need to be up to date and thus likely different; the HCP will be different and … the decision maker will be different.

    The way some people see around this is to copy word for word what they put in last time. It’s a great theory, and occasionally it will pay off, but, as per the above, too many other things have changed. It’s absolutely reasonable for two decision makers to look at exactly the same evidence and come to different conclusions. It escapes me completely why people think that so wrong. It’s what every human on the planet does every minute of every day of their life. Look at the same things as other people and come to different conclusions about them. Provided that conclusion is within a range of reasonable responses it is absolutely the case that someone with an ongoing award could be refused benefit next time around. 

    People tend to see their awards as absolutes; as definitive; as a vindication. “I got this because I am disabled and entitled”. Benefits are like everything else in life. They might look black and white but there are endless shades of grey. You may well have got enhanced rate of both PIP components on an ongoing basis but the burden of proof in social security is only the balance of probabilities and it’s perfectly possible to get a high and long award by the skin of your teeth just like you can be fortunate in all other matters. 
  • loracuk
    loracuk Member Posts: 5 Listener
    Thank you all for your replies. The letter from the dwp arrived with major inaccuracies from what was said on the phone assessment. 
    The uni disability officer has sent a comprehensive letter covering their inaccurate description of my interview so let’s see what happens now. Somehow I think it’ll end up going to a tribunal. 
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Member Posts: 25,573 Disability Gamechanger
    loracuk said:
    The letter from the dwp arrived with major inaccuracies from what was said on the phone assessment. 


    The assessment process isn't there for them to write what you said verbatim, if it was there would be no point in having the assessment. It's there for them to gather more evidence to support your claim. They then write the report which is their opinion based on everything you sent and what you said during the assessment.
    Focusing totally what was said on your decision letter and assessment report will not get you a PIP award. You're far better concentrating on where and why you think you should have scored those points.. ancedotal evidence speaks for itself, as advised above.
  • loracuk
    loracuk Member Posts: 5 Listener
    I did give them anecdotal examples and they said I could follow a journey alone without prompting which is the opposite of what I said and what my therapist wrote. 


  • loracuk
    loracuk Member Posts: 5 Listener
    I did give them anecdotal examples and they said I could follow a journey alone without prompting which is the opposite of what I said and what my therapist wrote. 


  • mikehughescq
    mikehughescq Member Posts: 8,234 Disability Gamechanger
    A fine example of what potentially goes wrong with PIP claims. Your therapist obviously hasn’t been with you on a journey alone. Therefore anything they write on that subject is not medical evidence. It’s merely a repetition of what you told them. There is case law which says that such repetition should not be dismissed because a medical professional would presumably not be so stupid as to repeat stuff unless they believed it to be true and the repetition can be taken as meaning you are credible. However, unless you’ve written some obviously inconsistent stuff, your credibility won’t have been issue anyway and so all your therapist has done is given you okay-ish non-medical evidence on a point not at issue. The other word for that, to be blunt, is “nothing”.

    Challenging inaccuracies in a HCP report is also not really the way to go. One persons “inaccuracy” so another persons “different opinion” and focusing on what a HCP got wrong means you’ve not focused on possible weaknesses in your own evidence. It demonstrates to DWP that you don’t really know what PIP is about or the evidence needed. It also means that when you get to tribunal you have already potentially lost the medical professional on the panel. Some don’t take kindly to a detailed critique of a fellow medical professional. The better route is almost always to highlight two or three irrefutable errors: very different to “they didn’t write down what I said” or “they have a different opinion to me”. Actual errors. 

    Now, what do you actually mean by anecdotal evidence? Lots of people say they put in anecdotal evidence but it turns out that’s not what they did at all. Did you put in detailed (half page) real world examples of actual incidents when you last or recently attempted each of the points scoring activities, or, did you put in something along the lines of “I can’t do this because…”? The latter is assertion not evidence. Interested to know. 

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