Scope's reply to the governments planned concessions to the green paper.
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Thanks alex, was not 100% sure on how the whole proccess works but hopefully it doesn't get to money bill if this passes 2nd reading
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Vouchers are not the worst idea in the world, as long as they provide sufficient flexibility for the people who need them, and take away the freedom for people abusing the system to spend the extra money on whatever they want.
People always say fraud within PIP is minuscule, but the way fraud is measured is the reason why its so small. The fact is, there are entire online communities of people being tutored about how to get on disability benefits. Once people get on PIP, and stay on PIP, they are all considered legitimate claims.
The people who are tutoring others to claim without real cause should be prosecuted to the extreme. And if they can identify participants who have been taught how to game the system….. they should be prosecuted, too, and be made to payback every penny they've claimed if found guilty as non-dischargeable debt.
So vouchers may actually be the answer as those restrictions will end the lifestyle claimants who have been tutored. I don't like it, but I recognise there is a real problem and burying our heads in the sand isn't going to solve it.
If they really got tough on the communities of people who are playing disability as a game, the move to a vouchers scheme may never be needed.
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@Holly_Scope hi holly , ..... Erm I know your not a politician and probably not sure about this either but I can't find any information and no one seems have replied , I'm feeling very scared at the moment and was just wondering something
Firstly I've always been assessed for ESA , technically I've never been assessed for LCWRA , I moved over to UC voluntarily and because of my ESA support group status I automatically qualified for LCWRA , I've been getting a mix of cbesa every two weeks and lcwra at the end of the month , so I'm right in thinking that I'm classed as a existing claiment
Secondly I'm on CBESA/LCWRA but no pip
So I guess everything stays the same for me ( assuming I pass the WCA that I'm overdue by nearly 4 years )
My question is what happens when the work capability assessments get scrapped and we all need to take a pip assessment to qualify for the UC health element ( lcwra ) .... Will all the many people in my situation be assessed through the old pip criteria as were existing claiment of ESA / lcwra .... Or will it be the new pip 4 point criteria as technically we are new pip claiments .... I have serve OCD and nothing goes in when I try to research things
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No worries, I’m learning from the other more knowledgeable and great folks on here. I do think it’s very underhand the way Government are going about this.
The link you posted to the ‘Benefits and Work’ post seems to me to be the best action anyone can take between now and Tuesday, that is to email your MP with concerns and I think mentioning the way they’re going about it, as well as the actual bill (of which there is no real detail) is valid.
Today, tomorrow, Monday…MPs can’t ignore these concerns by email.
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This is correct. If it's a money bill, the Lords are powerless to prevent it becoming law. The Lords can merely suggest amendments for a month that the government can keep tossing away, and once the clock is up the gov can proceed with the bill as is.
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Because a member on this thread posted they are in favour of vouchers!
Read it before attacking me.
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Yes, the verify ID comes after you submit. Once you submit you’ll have access to your journal and can request a phone call if you can’t verify online. It’ll come up that they’ll phone you in 2-3 days but they don’t! I just got a message to say my biographical phone call had been booked
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Seems so two weeks ago they been blinding us ahock horror and the conssessions he mentioned once bill passes there's no legal status if he wants to change back to all claimants and what was that all about with meg hillier was it a set up was she personally angry with starmer and showing her authority it's a mess all of this and we have to suffer he's always planned this we lost a week pushing back listening to more lies I don't know how many mps still against this can't find but they definitely cannot be trusted they have the back hander
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Yh I've emailed the speaker three times asking him to reject it gave reasons why maybe good if more people emailed him with I concerns alot of them
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People on this forum give helpful advice and support, as they do on Benefits &Work. Many legitimate Disabled Sites and charities do, thank god. Explaining things clearly is not helping others to cheat the system.
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Quick question.. how many letters should you send with your first pip claim?
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This part of the reason why we need PIP
And you guessed it - perhaps boring repetitive but true - KEEP GOING CAMPAIGNING. KEEP ON TRUCKING
We Buddhists say a mantra
''Extend the Vajra wall of determination…'
Google it for the full quote and education- mediation. Vajra is a symbol of sheer spitual and political determination, as long as the politics is done like Gandhi or Mandela or the Dalai Lama, with love, rigour persuasion, non-aggression.
We can still win compassion by objecting through your MP
(Please Google''FindyourMP UK''
I want to THANK everyone in SCOPE from the bottom of my mind-heart for
their sheer courage, solidarity, love, companionship, determination, for recovering time and again, for beating themselves up less via internalised oppressions, for being wonderful marvellous human beings, for growing and developing through this campaign, for not taking no for an answer, for wielding together a force for good, for working out disagreements with peace and love, for their compassion, wisdom, for not giving up on each other, and so much more.
You are all bigger, better, stronger wiser than you know
So… keep campaigning, meanwhile transforming any barriers to bridges.
Summer heat waves
Greenhouse gases.
War and fascists. Iran and USA Ukraine and Putin
Yet hope still blooms
For the human potential mind
For he one who meditates
on glass half full.
who refuse cynicism under the cloud of sufferings.
Did you know wise compassion is all.
Everything good in life To transform human strife. Yes, friends, make of your mind-heart, great art of mind creative, not mind reactive. Cultivate the flowers the joy the freedom
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Hi @Danny123 gosh, that's a scary thought. I'd probably give myself a day before I was removed from my position. 😅
I'm so sorry this is causing you so much distress and I wish I had some more answers on everything. I'm sure we all do. It's been a long period of constant focus and discussion everywhere (especially the media), and for those who will be impacted, it's been absolutely awful.
I believe the Governments intention is to eventually remove the WCA and replace this with a PIP assessment, but we don't know for sure exactly what will be agreed and implemented yet unfortunately. I appreciate it's terrible being in limbo at the minute. I can advise you to try to distract yourself, but I know sometimes that's easier said than done.
I will say though, seeing how in the past week so many MP's have taken a stand, and witnessing how swiftly things some decisions have turned gives me hope. All the work the community and ally's are doing is really making an impact so that's something positive to focus on.
I expect next week's going to be much like this week, if not more intense so please reach out if you need anything. We're a wonderful community and will support each other through this.
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And there we have it ''Any concessions we might make'' so many of these little gems sprinkled throughout many documents need clarification, might is not will.
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Hi @secretsquirrel1 - I can only presume the longer form (PIP2) dated Jan 2021 is the 'How your disability affects you' claim form, tho when I checked this is only 50pp long:
As far as review forms go, the AR1 forms, then a new one came out in Nov 2024. You can tell if you've received this one as it will have 11/24 at the bottom of each page as can be seen here:
What has happened tho to a few of our members is that they've received the PIP2 form when up for review, so I think this may be what you've heard.
There's also an AR2 form, the so-called 'light touch' PIP review form which is only 6pp long:
[Sorry, I can't find an example of the earlier AR1 form, but this was shorter than the 'new' one, which has 25pp. That one somewhat encouraged claimants to often put 'no change' to how they were affected without adding any detail whatsoever, which was why some had their claim reduced, or received no award at all]
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Thanks , ok.... so nothing on what form of the pip criteria ( present or new 4 point rule )for people in my position will need to take has been decided yet then
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ATTENTION
Apparently, no figures or evidence provided, there are extremely large communities of disabled people in this country playing a disability game.
It seems we are talking of hundreds of thousands of people. My guess as per comment above.
If you see anyone playing this game, which should not be very difficult as the number is exceptionally large, please report.
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I'm afraid it's hard to say. It depends on if/when all of these changes happen. There are so many variables associated with this particular proposed change. I'd really hope you'd be treated as a current claimant and protected the same way current PIP claimants are following the revisions.
Sorry I really want to be able to put your mind at ease. I'm just very aware that part or maybe even all of what's currently been proposed could change, as we've seen happen this week.
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