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Confused about who decides on paper based assessments

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  • kah22
    kah22 Community member Posts: 52 Courageous
    Have you asked for a copy of the report ?
    PA3 I belive for paper based

    CR
    I dot want to ask for assessment yet but as soon as it is then I’ll ask
  • kah22
    kah22 Community member Posts: 52 Courageous

    First of all my apologies as this is a longer message than I normally post.

    My friend has received her PIP award; standard rate care at £57.30 week and no help for mobility. The award to March 2021. As mentioned in other posts the assessment was paper based and the condition was Bipolar.

    We now turn to whether or not to look a mandatory review, she has received 11 points; that 1 extra would make a difference. I should say that while she will go for a MR but not to a Tribunal but we’ll not be saying that.

    In their ‘How I made my decision’ section the DM stated that ‘they used information provided by the letter from your psychiatrist. This comment I find particularly interesting: ‘The information provided by the telephone advice from your psychiatrist . From what I’ve been reading this seems to be uncommon ie they contacting the psychiatrist. I would imagine this is something I should ask for specifically in a SAR: . What advice did he give? They didn’t mention the GP’s letter or the support letter from myself.

    While I appreciate that a mandatory review may look at all descriptors in the hunt for that extra 1 point I would be homing in on the following. Preparing Food, Eating and Drinking, Reading, Communicating and Making Decisions about Money

    Preparing food. 2 from 8 For this activity she was awarded 2 points for needing prompting. However, I feel that they did not take into account her assertion that: ‘ It is not safe for me to use the hob because when in bipolar depression I cannot concentrate enough to complete the task and when in a manic state working with boiling water and naked flames becomes dangerous.’ Should that pass the reliability test? Not been able to do it safely. She has actually burned herself on a few occasions. I also feel that they should have given weight to motivation, concentration, and distraction.

    Eating and Drinking. 0 from 8 I feel they should have considered her lack of motivation because of deep depression and the tiredness. Again all mentioned in her application.

    Reading 0 from 10 In her submission she stated that when she gets ‘a letter from say Benefits people telling me e.g. about a change in benefits I am getting I have to get help in understanding this Form and what various parts of it means or which applies to me. The main part of why I needed help here was because I just couldn’t concentrate and I became very tired and depressed and afraid I will loose my benefits.’ Could the likes of that possibly cover 8 c or d.

    Communicating: 0 from 10. The DM said they decided that she can express and understand verbal information unaided While my friend is more likely to be in a depressed state she wrote that when she is manic she talks at lighting speed and constantly changes subjects. But when she is on a low she just does the bear minimum of talking. She very seldom uses the telephone. When on a high she has got violent and struck me, all this was mentioned in her form.

    Making budgeting decisions. 2 from 6 For those with bipolar this, I think, is a big one. The points were for making complex budgeting decisions but in her submission she gave three examples of how she treats money, this was when she was on a high. £80 clothes form second hand shop, £500 to a nephew getting married and £40 to a beggar in the street.

    While I will go through the other descriptors these, I feel, would be her strongest points, but please if you have any suggestions about PIP and Bipolar share them. 

    I not including here anything to do with mobility partly because when we filled the form in the High Court hadn’t declared the effective ban mobility illegal and we didn’t put as much effort into it as we did with the care section.

    I would be interested in your views and what the next step should be. That 1 extra point would make all the difference.
     
    Kevin

  • CockneyRebel
    CockneyRebel Community member Posts: 5,209 Disability Gamechanger
    Hi kevin

    Starting from the last, HCP & DWP should be assessing both parts of the claim so if mobility, is an issue go for it

    Remember that the majority of time comes in force so can you be sure that the descriptors mentioned are apparent for the majority of time ?

    CR
    Be all you can be, make  every day count. Namaste
  • mayfair
    mayfair Community member Posts: 39 Connected
    Hi @kah22 can’t offer any advice but I’m hoping it all works out please keep us updated on how things are progressing. 
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Community member Posts: 53,348 Disability Gamechanger
    Only 20% of MR decisions change and she does risk losing everything. That's a big risk in my opinion. Why risk it if you're not planning on taking it to Tribunal. The chances of a Tribunal going in your favour is around 70%, if you appear in person.

    At Tribunal, if they were planning on lowering an existing award they have to warn you first. This gives the claimant a chance to cancel the Tribunal before the hearing.
    I would appreciate it if members wouldn't tag me please. I have all notifcations turned off and wouldn't want a member thinking i'm being rude by not replying.
    If i see a question that i know the answer to i will try my best to help.
  • kah22
    kah22 Community member Posts: 52 Courageous
    We’ve applied for a copy of the Assessment Report and a SAR as we are going to MR

    Here is a breakdown of the GF assessment

    Preparing Food. 2

    Eating and Drinking. 0. Not surprised

    Mananging Treatments. 1

    Washing and Bathing 2

    Managing Toilet Needs. 0 Didn’t claim here at all

    Dressing and Undressing 2

    Communicating 0. This is an issue worth pushing, I think Yes?

    Reading 0 again not surprised but would like to here opinions

    Mixing With Other People 2

    Making Budgeting Decisions (complex) 2 No simple decisions

    Zero points for mobility. Again I wasn’t surprised as we had submitted our claim days before the court case result

    Initially I wasn’t surprised at the zero points for eating and drinking but then a contributor over on a bipolar Forum said he had actually got 4 points for this. I can see where encouragement can come in. I’m wondering if the descriptor also applies to over eating. When my GF is manic she will hardly eat anything but when in a depressed state she can’t seem to get enough.  I’m wondering how to approach this descriptor.  Ideas anybody ?

    Communication seems a big one for me and I’m stunned that we didn’t get any points there considering we did with mixing with other people. Again I’d appreciate how best to get this across to a DM when you are dealing with a flexible condition like Bipolar

    I’m also thinking of making a stronger case for mobility as we did not when filling in the initial Forum. At that stage it seemed mobility was been withheld from those with mental health so we didn’t put that much effort into it , I don’t expect to be awarded anything this time around but I’m putting the information out there for the big review when it starts

    Kevin

  • whistles
    whistles Community member Posts: 1,583 Disability Gamechanger
    Just my two pennies worth. 
    My award is also 2021, reviewed in two years. I decided to leave it alone. I will have to do all this again in two years anyway.
    Having an end date allows me to put a diary together etc.

    If you get esa does this not include the premium or has this stopped now? 

    I wish any one week with the MR. But I left it alone.
    Do not follow me, I don't know where I am going.
  • kah22
    kah22 Community member Posts: 52 Courageous
    Sorry don’t know about the premium I’m just helping my GF with all the research; she’d never get it completed

    Pat the moment my attention is focused on these two descriptors communication and eating a drinking, I be happy to hear your experiences

    Kevin

  • Laurastanners4
    Laurastanners4 Community member Posts: 20 Listener
    I got this text and was surprised. It must have been the extra evidence and ftf Assessments causes me stress. 
    We've received the written report of your PIP assessment. We will write to you once we've made a decision on your PIP. As a guide you should hear from us within 6 weeks. You don't need to contact us unless any of the details you gave us have changed. Thank you.
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Community member Posts: 53,348 Disability Gamechanger
    I got this text and was surprised. It must have been the extra evidence and ftf Assessments causes me stress. 
    We've received the written report of your PIP assessment. We will write to you once we've made a decision on your PIP. As a guide you should hear from us within 6 weeks. You don't need to contact us unless any of the details you gave us have changed. Thank you.
    It's a standard text message that's sent to everyone that puts a mobile number down on the PIP2 form. DWP just keep you updated through out your claim and there's always a report written and returned to DWP decision maker, who then makes a decision.

    You can ring DWP and ask for a copy of this report, this will give you some idea what the decision will be. Good luck.
    I would appreciate it if members wouldn't tag me please. I have all notifcations turned off and wouldn't want a member thinking i'm being rude by not replying.
    If i see a question that i know the answer to i will try my best to help.
  • Laurastanners4
    Laurastanners4 Community member Posts: 20 Listener
    Thanks but iam not waiting on the phone to the DWP it causes me stress 
  • Laurastanners4
    Laurastanners4 Community member Posts: 20 Listener
    This is me reapplying before my current award ends no review due to going to tribunal for current award 
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Community member Posts: 53,348 Disability Gamechanger
    There's no really any difference, apart from the review form being shorter but you should ignore the shortened version anyway and put down as much information as possible. The process for both is the same.
    I would appreciate it if members wouldn't tag me please. I have all notifcations turned off and wouldn't want a member thinking i'm being rude by not replying.
    If i see a question that i know the answer to i will try my best to help.
  • Yadnad
    Yadnad Posts: 2,856 Disability Gamechanger
    There's no really any difference, apart from the review form being shorter but you should ignore the shortened version anyway and put down as much information as possible. The process for both is the same.
    Is there any basis for saying that? If you are right I don't understand why they don't issue a full PIP2 form. What is the point of a shortened version and how do the DWP expect you to deal with it.
  • poppy123456
    poppy123456 Community member Posts: 53,348 Disability Gamechanger
    Yadnad said:
    There's no really any difference, apart from the review form being shorter but you should ignore the shortened version anyway and put down as much information as possible. The process for both is the same.
    Is there any basis for saying that? If you are right I don't understand why they don't issue a full PIP2 form. What is the point of a shortened version and how do the DWP expect you to deal with it.
    Yes, the basis is the same reasons why you should always put as much information down on the PIP2 form, there's no difference. The more information you put down the better for you.  Why did they bring out the shortened version? I've no idea, but claimants seen through this and realised that ticking the box "no change" can do more harm than good. They state on the review form that there's no need to send in any evidence they've previously seen.. would i listen to that and not send the evidence i sent before? Nope, of course i wouldn't and why wouldn't i? because i'll never ever trust DWP or the HCPs to look back at previous evidence i've sent, they most likely wouldn't in my opinion.

    Dealing with it? People don't because they will always worry, panic, have sleepless nights, not eat, experience more anxiety and always ask questions that people just can't answer... for example how long will it take after the assessment to make a decision, how long do i wait for a MR decision, no one can answer those questions because it's the same as asking how long is a piece of string. Basically the worry and stress of reassessments makes people worse than they were to begin with, which means they simply don't deal with it.
    I would appreciate it if members wouldn't tag me please. I have all notifcations turned off and wouldn't want a member thinking i'm being rude by not replying.
    If i see a question that i know the answer to i will try my best to help.

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