Green Paper Discussion (from 24th March, 2025)
Comments
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My wife receives a 4pt award for preparing a meal so that's one consolation .…
But she only receives 2pts for mixing with other people and 2pts for making budgeting decisions when I believe they should have been 4pt awards.
At her next review (2027) can I contest these 2pt awards ?
I like many others haven't contested the 2pts because overall she was awarded enough pts for the higher care component of pip .
It's a belt and braces approach but the more 4pt categories she scores in the better as a safety buffer.
Thanks in advance
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bigbob,
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“Wolves in sheep's clothing comes to mind!”
Thanks @jul1aorways…However,with these lot-They’ve just been Wolves all along the way…. And have turned out to be Blood ..oh “Money Thirsty Merciless Vampires”
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@jasray 100% /totally agree with you, sadly.
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I went through five dla assessments all with doctors i might add, before I got indefinite. Then forced onto pip.. zero points. Like many seem to get, so went to tribunal. They watched my every move, sent me out while they went through my notes, this lady springs up next to us, starts chatting, now I'm not great to say the least in social situations, so my mum had a few words with her in general conversation, this is what she said... "This is my 13th tribunal , I'm not letting them away with anything ,look at all my evidence,see all those cameras, watching us like hawks they are. ! All this in A very loud voice. I swear when I thought about it later she was put there on purpose to see what way I'd react. If I'd engage etc. Best bit is,about 18 mths later a similar thing happened to a friend. Anyway got my pip back. For three years,Second time 2 points,another tribunal only paper based, 3yrs again, third time 4 points, did and MR, got it again onthat for four yrs, due a review very soon. I'd rather eat rusty nails. The stress is unreal. Esp when the assessor inthe first instance couldn't even look up from the computer and the other two phone assessments were a total farce too. Lies ,untruths ,made up stories,whatever you want to call them.... what willit be like now with this 4 points nonsense. Dreading beyond dread, as last assessment nearly ended me.
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The way I see it , and am also looking at this is ....
Me , Like many other people that are in receipt of CBESA/ NSESA and LCWRA , but not pip will be hit as hard as everyone else but it doesn't seem to be getting hardly any attention anywhere ....
March 2026 ....cuts to LCWRA for new claims
November 2026 .... new criteria being implemented for new and existing claiments of pip , with new 4 points in one section of daily rule , and need to get 8 points over all
Wca assessment should stay the same , with no criteria change , till 2028 ....
So really all of us who just get CBESA or NEW style ESA and LCWRA all together are faced with this ....
Nothing will change for us until 2028 when the work capability gets abolished , all we need to concentrate on is this
Being prepared for a review at anytime ....
Being prepared for bank surveillance and hoping nothing flags up ....
Being prepared and concentrating on passing a wca reassessment that will take us up to 2028 ( that I'm sure will be ramping up soon ) as if your like me my last one was in 2019 , I was supposed to have another in 2021 , so five and a half years since my last and three and a half overdue , so I'm sure they will be getting round to them as these bastards are trying to cut anyway and any how ....
And then in 2028 when wca is abolished and pip takes over then preparing and trying to pass the pip criteria ....
I've just stopped worrying , don't get me wrong I'm terrified , I can't even function properly....but this is what is ahead of us and no amount of second guessing and torturing ourselves is going to change it , this is going to happen , and we just need to be as brave as we can and face it .... Because there's no other party that's going to reverse this , even if labour are as hated as they are now , the Tories and reform will probably be even worse if you can try and imagine that ....
No amount of energy and worry will change any of this .... Ive tried to just come on here once a week as It was affecting me to the point of desperation , I know it sounds strange but now that I've accepted it and I've got a clear plan of what's going on I feel a little less stressed
My lovely mum had open heart surgery last week and it was a little less straight forward than we would of liked , so I think I've been concerned about that and not really thought about all this other chaos , she finally comes home tomorrow thank god 🙏🏻 .... So I'm just going to enjoy this win 😌 ....
Let's be honest all the stress and worry of this isn't exactly going no where is it 🤦😌....
I hope your all ok and handling these terrible times best you can , take care and look after yourselves , none of us are alone in this and we're all in it together , as much as I think these changes will end up coming in , I'm hoping that they will see how harmful and ridiculous they are and there may be some amendments .... Because this is for sure these changes won't work and people will have to go through hell before the politicians will have to change things .... And let's have it right , this is 100% a cost cutting exercise , even the MPs can't explain the questions and the concerns that are being thrown at them .... It's nothing short of criminal
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I hear you, @Catherine21 and you’re absolutely right!
It does feel outrageous that they seem to be getting away with it, but I genuinely believe they only will if we stay silent. That’s why I feel it’s so important we keep pushing back, especially through these live consultations. Even if people are struggling to respond to all the 20 questions, they should try to focus on the most relevant ones, like PIP and UC , Work , whichever affects them!
Although they recommend adding your views under each question in the link, I feel it may be easier to voice your concerns via email in a narrative style(own words!), save them bit by bit (within your energy levels), and email them to consultation.pathwaystowork@dwp.gov.uk once complete. It might not feel like much, but every voice adds so much weight in a democratic society. And if we don’t speak up in this live consultation, they’ll just say “nobody objected.” and could potentially have the upper hand.
If 16 million people stay quiet, thinking it’s somebody else’s or Charities businesses, it will only benefit the Liebour lot in this instance. I honestly don’t see any other way out of this. In my mind, I view it like a massive Individualised Mandatory Reconsideration request.
From what I’ve seen, this lot seem ready to push through anything, no matter how senseless or cruel…..even if it means fighting it legally. But I still have hope, especially when people like you & everyone here are speaking out. That does make a difference.
Best wishes, Catherine! Please do look after yourself. Nothing is over…There’s still so much hope! 🤗
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Thinking of you Danny123
Take good care and glad your mum coming home.
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@Danny123 Really pleased your mum is coming home tomorrow and wishing her well for her ongoing recovery 🙏 take good care of yourself too.
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Hello all.
I tried to take time away just to get away from worrying but here I am on a sleepless night worrying.
My thoughts are:
That these cuts and changes will be disproportionately effecting disabled people surely none of it will be seen as lawful? Thing is I suspect Starmer intends to pass PIP/Universal Credit's changes as a money legislation (mentioned on here) meaning the Lords can't amend it and so it becomes the law of the land.
This PIP 4 Point Rule is nothing to do with money, surely that requires a different legislation and or a Green/White Paper?
The Green Paper and the subsequent White Paper may face legal challenges and possible amendments by the Lords. I think it's there where legal apparatus will be used.
Lastly I thought Labour would be the least worst option, they're even more worse than I imagined.
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Wishes for your mum’s ongoing recovery . Take care @Danny123
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"We will not know until they release further info on the WCA descriptors."
From what's released so far, there won't be any WCA descriptors, as the WCA itself is to be scrapped.
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Yet, there are over 2 million claimants who are currently on LCWRA. 1.8 million on UC, and the rest still on ESA.
People who are only on LCWRA and are not receiving any other benefits would be hit hardest - God forbid.
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Well, what they have released so far is not very clear. WCA is going to be scrapped for LCWRA but merged to PIP so all on LCWRA and PIP will have to do the new merged WCA. So EITHER they will have to remove mental health descriptors from the merged WCA to get rid of most mental health claimants from their benefits or add mental health descriptors to facilitate the most severe mental health conditions in the merged WCA.
PIP is really meant to be for mobility conditions and the costs for mobility. It does not really cater for mental health. Remembering that they have added the 4 point daily living making it harder for everyone anyway. This is not right. They have to give us more information on what the WCA is going to be whether they are going to facilitate mental health or not and whether they care about conditions that are NOT COVERED at all even now by the WCA.
If they are going to use the current PIP WCA just adding the 4 point in one descriptor for daily living to qualify it will mean EVERY mental health claimant will not qualify and many mobility claimants will not qualify. They need to give more info and be clear with it.
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I had a look at the points i was rewarded on my current pip, I don’t have the ‘mixing with people’ unless I didn’t get points for that, I do have points for engaging with people face to face is that the same as it sounds the same
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I'm sorry 🙏 to hear that you've had such a bad night.
You must feel powerless to do anything but that doesn't need to be the case. 😊
Have you heard of Disabled People Against Cuts? 🤔
They organised the big protest in London recently that was all over the media against these wicked proposals. 💪
🔗 https://dpac.uk.net/
Also, are you aware of Benefits and Work? I've been a member for years and I don't know where I would be without their expert benefit guides. I can't recommend them enough to give you a proper chance to submit the best evidence you can when you get your next assessment.
🔗 https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/
They both have campaigns to submit evidence, directly to parliament so you can tell them how the proposals will affect you as a disabled person and more you can take part in besides.
DPAC is £2 a year for membership and B&W is £20. You can sign up for their newsletters whether you're a member or not.
I do hope that you will consider having a look into them both if you have not been aware of them. Good Luck. 🤞 🍀 😊
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Yes they are the same :)
I’ve heard both being used, but it’s the exact same thing.
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I was denied PIP in 2014 , I got 4 points for mixing with people as i wear dark glasses and cannot look people in the eye .
I was awarded PIP in 2023 and put the same thing down and got 2 points , this shows me that different assessors have got no clue at all and just tick a number that they see fit .
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Woken up to another day of emotions all over the place I'm at cmht tomorrow pribley waste if time for 4 weeks !! Managing emotions who thinks anything is possible in 4 weeks angers me as after times up thier like you did so well oh go away sorry one minute up next down hair falling out face hand body goes numb doctor said anxiety what do you do when you can't escape reality I don't drink anymore and labour have tested me ! But I won't let them take me back to those drinking days !! Fed up low angry sad ok one minute next raging scared lost vunerable weak
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Same as me even darling glasses in winter if I can't find my sunglasses I freak out
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