Guest Post: The tangled process of PIP - injustice for disabled people?

wildlife

@bendigedig Do you think the lack of interest re: Facebook is an issue about being Anonamous. I have nothing to hide but still I'm on FB and wouldn't want friends and family to read about my benefit problems. Has this been considered? 

neil1972

I have taken 12 months to finally be awarded PIP after winning a tribunal but looking at my mandatory reconsideration notes the person at the DWP had wrote down I needed an aid to help me wash and bathe but not awarded me the 2 points for it. The judge at the tribunal had noticed this mistake. I'm now waiting to see if I will receive my back pay or if they will appeal. I'm also hoping my partners carers allowance will be back paid to may last year but I don't think it will because they say it will only be back paid 3 months but it was their mistake that has ended up in it taking this long

chronicendeavors

SapphireStanton said:

The system is flawed beyond belief and is designed to work against the very people that need it the most. 

There is a formular to the forms and not enough people know HOW to complete them. This coupled with targets for refusals, a lack of understanding of the complex nature of conditions and a disturbing anti-male gender bias has made applying for the support we are entitled to  a mine field. 

I'm  lucky.  I know the formular. I know how to answer the questions honestly but successfully and I do my best to share this with others in a similar  position. 

Certainly in my local area the official advocates have no idea what they are doing in this regard, unless they too are charged with saving the DWP a buck or two. I have had to clean up the disastrous applications done through the local advocates more than once. Sadly this can mean the claimant having to go through the procedure, being turned down right up to tribunal and starting again from  scratch.  We all know how stressful it is.

This year I have swapped from DLA to PIP myself and worked with 5 others both in person and on line. The males have recieved poorer service from the assessors, to the extent of outright lying  and subsequently recieved a lower award. 
I have even had to sit one applicant down and ask whyvthe would accept help from the DWP to complete the forms, when it is publically known that  they are there to reject as many claims as possible. 

The crazy thing is, the actual figures for benefit fraud are microscopic in comparison to those of us that have been treated abysmally. The deficit the government love to shout about could easily be met by tax avoiders paying their fair share and MPs being honest with their expenses.

I'd rather a very very few claim when they shouldn't because TOO many successful claims than one more vulnerable, frightened sick person  to through this process

@SapphireStanton I'm very sorry to hear of your difficulties. Thank you for helping, especially when they want you to withdraw. 

Your comment is great and exactly the sort of attitude that makes me proud of this country. It gives me hope , as I'm sure it does you. The only way we can beat this is if we band together. 

All the best! 

chronicendeavors

wildlife said:

@bendigedig Do you think the lack of interest re: Facebook is an issue about being Anonamous. I have nothing to hide but still I'm on FB and wouldn't want friends and family to read about my benefit problems. Has this been considered? 

@wildlife Thank you for your suggestion. It is a very valid point ! We do have an option for a 'secret' group, and that means your friends can't necessarily see your activity in the group , just members. Would that be a solution? 

chronicendeavors

neil1972 said:

I have taken 12 months to finally be awarded PIP after winning a tribunal but looking at my mandatory reconsideration notes the person at the DWP had wrote down I needed an aid to help me wash and bathe but not awarded me the 2 points for it. The judge at the tribunal had noticed this mistake. I'm now waiting to see if I will receive my back pay or if they will appeal. I'm also hoping my partners carers allowance will be back paid to may last year but I don't think it will because they say it will only be back paid 3 months but it was their mistake that has ended up in it taking this long

@neil1972 I'm so sorry to hear you have had to go through all that just to get what you deserve! I didn't know there was a limit on the back payments, is this for pip and carers allowance? I hope you get what you are owed! How disgusting to keep money rightfully yours. Keep us updated, won't you. 

All the best!

bendigedig

Its our Nation.

We should be saying how we want it to be run.

Facebook?  I'd rather see mass protest.  I never suggested Facebook.  Im just responding to the suggestions of others.

Nothing will get done if people do nothing for themselves.  If you want to let them run rough shod over you all then just let them.  Thats whats happening and you are all doing nothing about it.

Frightened to speak out,  frightened to reveal your concerns, frightened to breathe.

See where your anonymity and bennefit embarrasment gets you then?  When you've all lost your welfare state and its TOO LATE to do anything.

If anybody is as serious as I am about wanting to do somthing, just let me know.  Until then Ill just sit back and just watch it all go on thinking how sad it is that nobody is doing ANYTHING to stop it.

@wildlife

I think people have become inherently selfish.  They've forgotten how to care for one another.   Nothing is as important to the individual these days as the individual is to themself.  Very sad.

People have bought into the society that they've had sold to them.   Dragons Den, Bennefit Street, The Aprentice.  Hours of mind bending BBC propaganda.    AAARRRRGGGHHH.  

I dont want to tell people how to think but for gods sake if sombody doesnt start thinking soon they will take that off you all too!

I despair.

Why should I bust a gut over people who cant be bothered to even speak out!  

Is that where we are?  Is that how limited everybody is?

No cause, no focus, no unity, no voice.  Prety soon NO RIGHTS.

@chronicendeavors

Thank you for your support and encouragement.  I think Im losing the will to keep on with this now.  Tonnes of people here in this community want to write reams about their own problems.  When it comes to helping each other though nobody has it in them to say anything.

And that will be the end for the British people.  They will just become an entire nation of "me me's "  concerned only with their own lot.  Thats why things have gotten this bad already and thats why they are going to get a whole lot worse.

We are ALL very much alone and VERY vulnerable until we decide to come together and do something about it.

wildlife

@bendigedig If you think my motives for not wanting to be on FB as myself are purely selfish you couldn't be more wrong. My claim is more or less sorted for now so I wouldn't still be hanging around on here trying to help others. I'd be away enjoying life. I actually spend all day every day doing things for others within the limitations of my condition. Have just sent a box full of hand knitted clothes to a charity to be sent out to hospitals. 
On here I'm not giving negative, laid back advice. So much so I don't agree with certain people's attitude to sorting out benefit problems. I tell people they don't have to submit, be strong and proactive You're so right we need to put a stop to what is happening but at the same time I try and see things from all angles and way up pros and cons before acting. I can see DWP investigators having a field day if they know the identity of members of  your proposed group. I'm sure a closed secret group won't stop them identifying who people are. We all know how they see you doing a small thing like typing on a computer and blow it up out of all proportion. If they had their way we'd all be stuck indoors sitting a chair all day acting like zombies. The regular review times of only a few years don't help like I said before you have to be as bad as you can be and stay like it otherwise you'll lose what benefit you've got. I can't see how members of a FB group can be as anonymous as we are on here. Scope protect our identity would Facebook do the same? A closed secret group has been mentioned  but then you'd be defeating the object of bringing this matter to public attention. So it's not the fight I'm against it's the use of FB to do it.

nemoverum

Have my assesment in a few days. I have asked for home assesment as i have meltdowns when I'm out. But they refused.  Worried if i have a meltdown. I'm scarred if i have a meltdown there they might call police. If i have one on the way anything can happen and if if don't go if will definitely lose what independance I have.

Conrad

Hi.. I thought I was the only one.. will tell my story in a while.. my mental health has suffered major set backs  and my mobilty is really bad.. and the way Ive been treated by capita is astonishing.. this came up on my fb.. so.. I look forward to sharing my story so far.. 

HopelessinHerts

I literally had my tribunal Monday May 8th for PIP. It was horrific to say the least.

I have Aspergers, PTSD, OCD, social anxiety, panic, depression and Ménière's disease. All are hidden disabilities apart from its possible to assume I walk around inebriated all hours of the day because of the MD, I've had a few delightful comments made about that one.

i physically can't go out on my own, either my husband or one of the older children have to be their in case of anxiety or more importantly, a vertigo attack. Very nasty, very scary and can lead to something called a drop attack (or Tumarkins Otolithic Crisis if you want to get technical) I've had three since November.

Somy initial application for PIP was denied, my mandatory reconsideration was denied so I thought I'd go tribunal. My husband and kids look after me, I'm lucky to cook once a month due to accidents in the kitchen, I have someone wait around the bathroom as balance is a huge issue. Lots of things that prevent me being as independent and as lonesome as I once was.

The first tribunal date was adjourned due to lack of medical evidence, I don't seem to get the referrals other people do from my GP so they requested my notes. Second date set and I was confident that maybe, just maybe, my struggles would be recognised. The judges were awful, they literally raised eyebrows of confusion as I explained the impact my disabilities had on me. One went as far as to suggest that I don't eat properly, not because of the depression, that it was because of my teenage children who eat all the food in the house before I can get any, even my husband was becoming frustrated at this point.

Anyway, the outcome was sent by letter yesterday morning, application denied as I didn't show enough difficulties. Quite how to 'show' the soul destroying tinnitus you experience 24 hours a day, or the vertigo that can come on whilst sitting, the constant imbalance, the anxiety or depression, the PTSD that can be triggered by a sound, smell or memory flashback I don't know.

I'm not giving up. I'm looking at a second tier tribunal if I can get my head around the error of law criteria, unfortunately the other effect of Ménière's is brain fog so it might take a few days but it's catch 22, stress is a primary contributor to MD symptoms.......

Nystagmite

Ah, the whole "I can't see it, therefore, it doesn't exist". They said that to me about my hearing problems. You can't look at me and know what I hear and I'm not going to sit there and really ask if you've just swore at me. (yes, I've really misheard someone swearing at me!) Nor do I really want to sit there and keep asking you to repeat yourself. Because i heard fine at assessment, (read: there was no background noise) I don't have hearing problems at all. 

But apparently, they know more than my hearing therapist and ENT.

It's best if you can find someone who can help you in regards to your second tier tribunal.

Unfortunately, like you, I've now started with the vertigo. Especially whilst sitting.

I get the impression these people doing the assessments don't have a clue about disabilities in the first place. Mine even asked me what Hyperacusis was. Why the hell was she assessing me if she doesn't know what it is? I know it's not about the condition; but how can I be assessed by someone who doesn't know what one of my conditions is? I don't think she even knows much about Autism or the other problems I have.

HopelessinHerts

@Nystagmite my f2f assessor had not even heard of Ménière's Disease and in her words 'confessed to being a police station paramedic more used to fighting injuries and alcohol related issues', the panel at tribunal were just as ignorant.

I don't think many people get  what hyperacusis is, my daughter was diagnosed with it and the GP has suggested that I have it too, but it's difficult to explain to someone who has no understanding of it, how can you explain that noise is painful, the same as sensory processing disorder

chronicendeavors

wildlife said:

@bendigedig If you think my motives for not wanting to be on FB as myself are purely selfish you couldn't be more wrong. My claim is more or less sorted for now so I wouldn't still be hanging around on here trying to help others. I'd be away enjoying life. I actually spend all day every day doing things for others within the limitations of my condition. Have just sent a box full of hand knitted clothes to a charity to be sent out to hospitals. 
On here I'm not giving negative, laid back advice. So much so I don't agree with certain people's attitude to sorting out benefit problems. I tell people they don't have to submit, be strong and proactive You're so right we need to put a stop to what is happening but at the same time I try and see things from all angles and way up pros and cons before acting. I can see DWP investigators having a field day if they know the identity of members of  your proposed group. I'm sure a closed secret group won't stop them identifying who people are. We all know how they see you doing a small thing like typing on a computer and blow it up out of all proportion. If they had their way we'd all be stuck indoors sitting a chair all day acting like zombies. The regular review times of only a few years don't help like I said before you have to be as bad as you can be and stay like it otherwise you'll lose what benefit you've got. I can't see how members of a FB group can be as anonymous as we are on here. Scope protect our identity would Facebook do the same? A closed secret group has been mentioned  but then you'd be defeating the object of bringing this matter to public attention. So it's not the fight I'm against it's the use of FB to do it.

@bendigedig @wildlife the group was suggested as place to find people who are happy to share their story. There is a lot of noise on Facebook already with other groups about pip etc. 

I can probably speak for a few people when I say that this process has left me with hardly any fight left. 

My tribunal has been adjourned as they await 2 and a half years of doctors notes...because letters summarising aren't enough apparently. I have limited energy and right now I gotta concentrate on that, which sucks. Going back over all those years of not being believed has not done well for my mental health  (like they care) 

aries

Bendigedig
This process grinds you down so much. As you say it's an awful feeling when you feel no body is listening or believing you. 
I wish you the best for your tribunal please keep updated.
Aries

curious212000

Dear One and All,
This situation of corruption of the Benefits system by the Governments Department for Works and Pensions, cannot continue. I will be approaching my MEMBER OF PARLIAMENT for Somerton & Frome, David Warburton to arrange a meeting with the Minister of State, David Gaulke M.P. a.s.a.p. I will raise several issues namely P.I.P. disputes and the appeals' procedures.,The Disabled Badge Scheme and the abuse of. also much more petty items to some but important to others, certain issues.

Kind regards,

David Gosling.

Barrylad1957

@chronicendeavors
Absolutely fantastic post, and thank you for sharing it with us. It seems to be that, when the last 4 Prime Sinisters talked about the UK "Leading a revolution in the way mental health problems are treated" (Camoron) and "Re writing the script when it comes to how the disabled are treated" (May), what they actually meant was, 'We will use a combination of gov friendly media, the whips of public opinion, burgeoning benefit regulations and psychocompulsion to force the mentally ill and the chronically disabled into work and off support by literally leaving them with no other options'. A huge part of the neoliberal/centrist scheme that seems to run the planet these days is the ideal that work will make you free - and we've all heard that somewhere before, havent we?
Between 1974 and 1983, I was an active and violent criminal, and have often, back in those dark pre-reform days, been detained by the police and interviewed - often quite brutally, and rightly so  - by a variety of different forces and divisions up and down the country; I always accepted that it was my own doing that had gotten me there in the first place, and always accepted punishments with good grace. However, I have never, never felt as pre-judged to be guilty of some criminal offence as I have since walking into a jobcentre after being forced out of work due to ill health for the first time in 33 years. The system is stacked against you; for instance, the jobcentre insist that you have a mobile phone or contact number that is in credit all the time - even when youve submitted fit notes - yet, now, the assessors who we are forced to consult with to get help use the fact that you actually have a 'phone to state that you are not socially isolated or anxious. Its definitely a tory schemme now, but let us not forget that this particular boulder was initially rolled down the hill in our direction by a pseudo labour 'government' led by Blair and Brown. Things need to change, but as long as the media are diluting our strength by accusing sick people of malingering, and the general public are accepting of that view, its going to be extremely difficult.