Welfare benefits news, possible changes & constructive ‘discussion - an ongoing thread
Comments
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Actually a lot of interesting articles from disability news service:
https://www.disabilitynewsservice.com/dwp-complaints-rise-by-more-than-a-fifth-in-one-year/
https://www.disabilitynewsservice.com/nearly-three-quarters-of-calls-to-equality-helpline-relate-to-disability-new-figures-show/https://www.disabilitynewsservice.com/work-coach-whistleblowers-describe-jobcentre-safeguarding-failures/
apparently just only 1.3k people respond to the wca reform consultation - which sounds really low to me considering there are millions of disabled people (and their carers) in the uk - I just hope that we don’t come to regret that the turnout wasn’t higher0 -
That is a worryingly low number. I think it may be because not a lot of people knew about the consultation. They didn't exactly sing the news from the rooftops. Or possibly people thought it wouldn't matter, which seems to be a running thread with political goings on these days.0
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I think its disgusting how the disabled are treated and while I understand why they are doing it now bank accounts will be spied on :
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Not confirmed in even a pencilled in way at this specific moment in time - many possibilities of how this may play out at time if at allRay212 said:I think its disgusting how the disabled are treated and while I understand why they are doing it now bank accounts will be spied on :2 -
My heart sunk when I initially read that figure (I won’t type my full feelings as potentially offending isn’t a good way to get a point across and motivate)Albus_Scope said:That is a worryingly low number. I think it may be because not a lot of people knew about the consultation. They didn't exactly sing the news from the rooftops. Or possibly people thought it wouldn't matter, which seems to be a running thread with political goings on these days.
I was trying to persuade others to fill in the consultation not because I thought the people reading our inputs would take account but because it would be harder for the gov to justify and/or bury things the more whom contributed
there are 16 million disabled people in the uk (not including support systems/unofficial carers) and less than 0.01% of those contributed to the consultation (one of the few opportunities the disabled community may have to ‘encourage’ the gov to somewhat shift directions)
- I think albus, you may of left a comment on the ‘possible bank monitoring’ thread that 3k responses to a gov survey wasn’t a reason for the dwp to jump to conclusions, I think your comment on that thread also have relevance here (I hope I understood your comment correctly and not misinterpreted)
perhaps the 1.3k who did contribute will be enough (or the Tory’s so consumed with infighting they get zero done in their possible last13 months - stranger things have happened!)
The only plus side is that individual that has taken out the legal case against the gov’s approach to the constitution
(I know many want to wait for 100% confirmation on certain thing before saying or doing anything but the window of opportunity may be gone by then - I understand wanting to wait before ‘acting’, but there’s no such limit on ‘preparation’ - hence my current research mode!)0 -
apple85 said:
Not confirmed in even a pencilled in way at this specific moment in time - many possibilities of how this may play out at time if at allRay212 said:I think its disgusting how the disabled are treated and while I understand why they are doing it now bank accounts will be spied on :
It was reported in several places including the telegraph. How do you know its not pencilled in ?
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The telegraph, a newspaper article... will say no more. It’s all speculation at the moment.Ray212 said:apple85 said:
Not confirmed in even a pencilled in way at this specific moment in time - many possibilities of how this may play out at time if at allRay212 said:I think its disgusting how the disabled are treated and while I understand why they are doing it now bank accounts will be spied on :
It was reported in several places including the telegraph. How do you know its not pencilled in ?2 -
Yeah that's cool. Though I first heard it from Baroness Jenny Jones. Whether its bought in or not I thought it would add to the conversation. I mean that's what a forum is for isn't it? Most of the posts on this thread are speculative
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Hi woodbine. I am new on this thread. Which changes are these?
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Tonawanda17 said:Hi woodbine. I am new on this thread. Which changes are these?
There's no changes to anything as it's all speculation at the moment...
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I can’t respond the way I’d like to on your postwoodbine said:I really think we must be ultra cautious about discussing "potential" or even imagined changes to the benefits system as it can cause real (not imagined) worry to some members here.
These changes if and when any of them happen can be ultra slow, PIP first became a reality in 2013 there are still adults today on DLA still not been moved across to PIP.
Like others I only worry about these things when I really have to as in when the letter comes through the door, until then I carry on as I am.
(I think after this post I’m going to take at least a weeks break from this forum because though I like reading fiction I feel like a few think I may be writing it too - I don’t like the thought of being more of a hindrance than a help, hence a self imposed time out - I’ll be back in time to keep an ear out on the autumn statement for whatever that may or may not bring)
i admit this forum does have a lot of people who go into ‘headless chicken mode’ (by that I mean they read one article or headline which puts the fear part of the brain into overload which is hard for some to shut that down)
but there are those bordering on ‘head in the sand’, reasoning in every way possible why something won’t happen and accepting in the case it does.
there is massive value in being able to not over react and stay level headed
but fear can sometimes be the catalyst for a more productive reaction
yes there is precedent of the gov implicating things at snails pace but if you look there is also precedent of policies being rush out at lightning speed (plus we have a very different breed of minister is gov now than compared to when PIP was first introduced)
and to be blunt I don’t see the point of ignoring a problem (even if there’s only a 10% of it actually happen) if there is any possibility that I could contribute to something that could help reduce the percentage odds of something happening or eliminate the possibility beyond all doubt.
some things in life do sort themselves out by themselves but some things need intervention
so I hear you when you imply that the probability of any of this happening anytime soon is close to zero and perhaps more people than I release have a backup plan if the unlikely odds do happen they don’t affect your ability to live a healthy, safe life
but I’m one of those people that needs to know I did every I could to eliminate any future possible problem regardless of its probability
plus those whom are prone to panic will find these articles all by themselves and discussion does help some some to work things through and calm themselves down (telling some to stop panicking more likely than not makes them panic more, also saying others could be imagining or creating things is also often counterproductive)0 -
Hi people, can anyone help? I believe I am affected by the PIP daily living activity 9 change which they are reassessing at the moment. I realise it is going to take until 2025 to review all cases but what I am not sure on is if I need to get in contact with DWP or wait until I hear from them to have my case reviewed. Anyone know pls?0
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judie said:Hi people, can anyone help? I believe I am affected by the PIP daily living activity 9 change which they are reassessing at the moment. I realise it is going to take until 2025 to review all cases but what I am not sure on is if I need to get in contact with DWP or wait until I hear from them to have my case reviewed. Anyone know pls?
You do not need to contact them, they will contact you. They will only contact you if the extra points will mean a higher award. https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/personal-independence-payment-changes/social-support-changes-to-pip-law-from-6-april-2016
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Thank you Poppy. I think it would have put me into the higher daily living group which is what I am in now. I'll wait patiently!0
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(Apologies in advance for the long post - I’m anxious and p***ed if I’m being blunt!)
I did not want to be back on this thread so soon (I was taking a break till the 22nd nov) but something has just popped up on my newsfeed that though entails scaremongering to the highest degree, the source that I’m going to post is directly from the government so it’s past rumour territory and onto ‘will it officially be made law or not)
there are further details on other articles but I’m not going to point those as that’s media like Birminghammail and Manchestereveningnews - if one of the big newspapers post with sources I may post then but I’d probably advise to avoid reading those right now
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/employment-support-launched-for-over-a-million-peopleI know many of the long term forum members are trying to reason with others not to worry about something till it’s fully implemented which I understand, and right now everything is rumours
However we are less than a week away from the chancellors autumn statement and though we can’t pen in future policy goals by Hunt/Stride, we are now getting snippets and previews and right now it looks like we are expecting the biggest attack on societies most vulnerable (including the disabled community) in the last 2 decades and I’m not using that statement lightly
(the only thing I can’t tell is if the govs aim will be implemented for legacy benefits or uc claimants only which may buy some breathing space/time for a new gov to reverse things)
I can’t even start contemplating the consequences if something like this goes ahead because there are certain topics the scope forum does not like us to discuss regardless of right or wrong and that needs to be respected.
For a few weeks now I’ve been remembering an old childhood memory - when I was younger there was a children’s animation called ‘the animals of farthing wood’ (got so big I think Harrods (or similar) in London had an themed animatronic window display over one Xmas) - anyways one of the particular scenes that seems to imprint to memory is a certain hedgehog scene……..
I think I’m remembering that scene because the majority of the disabled community in my viewpoint seem to be acting like those hedgehogs (who roll up as a defense mechanism - may be effective against other animals but useless against certain man made inventions) ……….. yes hedgehogs have little feet and can’t move fast to escape things…………but in that scene the hedgehogs were better off trying to move towards safety (somewhere better) even though the odds of success were minimal than if they rolled up in balls (where in comparison odds of success would not exist)
(I hope the above analogy made sense in a gentler way than just being blunt)
my honest thoughts are yes, in the past in the ids era, the implementing of new policies took and is still taking a month of Sundays
however since sunak has taken over, him and his ministers have been a total different beast - one without compassion and willing to rush things through no matter how badly thought out.
An example of this is the following bill - https://bills.parliament.uk/bills/3429/stages (believe me the last thing I wanted to do is post this as an example but it best illustrates to point I’m trying to make)
this new law got rushed through much quicker than it should of done given the sensitive subject and the only reason why the law implementation is being held up is because human rights lawyers and the courts have gotten involved.
it’s a post for another day but there are several cases where the court of appeals/supreme court has reversed or amended part of the welfare criteria/laws, which was often triggered by 1 or a group of normal claimants initially taking something to the upper tribunal stage of appeal
quick examples (not necessary success but still trying) of this being:
https://www.thesun.co.uk/money/24606469/benefits-personal-independence-payments-department-for-work-pensions/
https://inews.co.uk/news/legacy-benefits-court-case-explained-appeal-result-meaning-dwp-2091448
so for those saying you won’t worry about it till your hit with it, it’s great you can ignore it or your not worried because you have a backup plan - that’s great for you but doesn’t help anyone else.
the reality is that if the worst gets announced at the chancellors autumn statement this will mentally & psychologically effect numbers of existing claimants regardless off whether it actually gets implemented or not
hence why I’ve been crying out for months for this community to find a way to fight back, create some backlash and stop being easy targets for departments like the dwp to take aim at for the sole reason of balancing books
and why I again ask disability charities when actual action (in additional to media quotes that are all to easy for politicans to ignore alone) in terms of legal action finally going to be taken???
(in my recent readings i stumbled across the term ‘Democide’ - I wonder that along with what we now know from the Covid enquiry and dwp policy over countless years is this a term that the disabled community has been victim of for a couple of decades now?)1 -
From the times (more reputable than the Birminghammail) - part of me doesn’t want to post as it is scary but people have a right to know what may happen so they have as much possible time to create backlash/fight/try and stop it from happening if that’s a possibility:Benefits claimants who refuse to look for a job will lose their right to free NHS prescriptions, dental care and help with energy bills under a “whole state” approach to forcing people back to work.In a trial, sick notes will be approved by the benefits system rather than doctors. Patients will be treated by therapists working for the Department for Work and Pensions, which could cut GPs out of the process.Under a “stick and carrot” approach to getting people back to work, Jeremy Hunt is promising a big expansion of support schemes, such as life coaches for the long-term sick, and is threatening “consequences” for those who fail to take jobs.The chancellor will use the autumn statement next week to set out a “back to work plan”. Business is struggling with a million vacancies at the same time as a record 2.6 million people are off work because of long-term illness.A £2.5 billion package will offer talking therapies to 380,000 more people and will double a “universal support” scheme that began in March. It will now offer help with debt, addiction and relationship problems to 100,000 people.Mel Stride, the work and pensions secretary, has argued that these schemes can pay for themselves by getting people back to work. They will “help more people start, stay and succeed in work. We know the positive impact work can have, not just on our finances, but our health and wellbeing too,” he said, adding: “Our message is clear: if you are fit, if you refuse to work, if you are taking taxpayers for a ride, we will take your benefits away.”At present people who refuse to take a job or attend interviews and coaching can have their benefits docked. But ministers want go further and shut benefits claims entirely if people have been “disengaged” for six months. This would mean tens of thousands of people not only losing all benefits but other state services where eligibility is linked to receipt of benefits.These include free prescriptions and dental care, legal aid and help with the costs of using courts and visiting prisons, help from energy suppliers, funeral payments, cheaper mobile phone packages and travel discount schemes. The sanctions will not apply to claimants with children or disabilities.“We’re serious about growing our economy and that means we must address the rise in people who aren’t looking for work,” Hunt said. “These changes mean there’s help and support for everyone — but for those who refuse it, there are consequences too. Anyone choosing to coast on the hard work of taxpayers will lose their benefits.”Ministers are prepared for criticism from health campaigners, but a government source insisted: “The question taxpayers will ask is, why if someone is fit and able — with plentiful vacancies, with 18 months of support available, and still completely refusing to engage — should they be shelling out to pay their benefits, and the extras that many will look upon quite enviously?”The Times revealed in the summer that Stride was pushing for reform of the “fit note” system after becoming frustrated that GPs were signing off work almost everyone who asked, after consultations lasting only seven minutes.Today sees the beginning of a “WorkWell” service where the benefits system will directly employ occupational health specialists and mental health counsellors to help people back to work. Under trials in 15 areas, people wanting a fit note will be referred to this service for assessment and treatment designed to get them back to work.Stride has said it is crucial that his department is “in the driving seat” because an overstretched NHS has little incentive to focus on people getting back to work. Successful pilots could lead to GPs being out of the “fit note” system altogether, which government sources argue would ease pressure on family doctors.Victoria Atkins, the new health secretary, said: “Tailored work and health support initiatives can help break down the kinds of barriers that can make finding and staying in a job more difficult for those with mental health conditions. Backing them with further investment means they’re more widely available, enables personalised help and will get thousands back to work by overcoming any issues that may be preventing them from fulfilling their career potential.”
Edit: at least the bbc has started covering these things (kind of buried but it’s a start)1 -
This is why newspaper articles should be taken with a very large pinch of salt and this includes "The Times"This here... is quite misleading in comparison to the first link you posted this evening. In my opinion, they've twisted it to make it seem worse.apple85 said:Benefits claimants who refuse to look for a job will lose their right to free NHS prescriptions, dental care and help with energy bills under a “whole state” approach to forcing people back to work.This was taken from this link... https://www.gov.uk/government/news/employment-support-launched-for-over-a-million-peopleStricter sanctions for people who should be looking for work but aren’t – including targeting disengaged claimants by closing the claims of individuals on an open-ended sanction for over six months and solely eligible for the Universal Credit standard allowance, ending their access to additional benefits such as free prescriptions and legal aid;In the above link it also says..The government is announcing two measures to address and penalise disengagement, and incentivise claimants to re-engage with Jobcentre support: closing claims of disengaged claimants after 6 months.Claims will be closed of individuals who are solely eligible for the standard allowance, meaning they are not receiving additional child, housing or disability Universal Credit payments. This means parents claiming the child element and receiving additional benefits like free school meals are not in scope of this measure and will not lose out. This is also the case for disabled claimants in receipt of the disability element of UC and receiving any additional benefits derived from their UC eligibility;
I've highlighted the most important parts in bold above. I will continue to stand by what i said earlier in the thread. Nothing is final until the regulations have been changed.
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If the worst changes from the recent wca constitution goes ahead (we should know on the 22nd) then not many of us on this forum will be considered ‘disabled enough’ by the dwp (the descriptors and ‘substantial risk’ element of the wca is kind of vital for many of us getting an esa/uc award altogether or at the very least in the support group) - if wca reforms are confirmed a lot of us could get lassoed into this other stuff by default
(and yes I do hear the ‘nothing is final’ line but this bunch of Tory ministers are so lacking in empathy unless something external blocks this or slows it down, sunak still has a 60 majority for another 13 months!)
and I hear what you are saying, especially with the time’s article as that seemed to list more ‘withholding of services’ threats than any other article I read on the story - however the times does have direct access to ministers and insiders that could provide additional info - but even ignoring that article the times newspaper is aimed at middle to upper class Tory members as part of their audience who tend to be right leaning rather than extreme far right (the moderates) - the way the times wrote up this new policy is very inflammatory and for those able to see the whole picture, pretty distasteful.
point is why would the tory party okay an article that may even create backlash from their own moderate supporters (I guess it could get an edit request in the next 24 hours - but right now the tory party are obviously happy with the written content being out there)………….actually the tory party never okayed the times braverman interview did they? (Though there were reports of displeasure the next day)
forgive me Poppy, like many I’m exhausted by the sheer amount being released by ministers & the dwp and though I have an great support system I still feel like I’m drowning, gasping for air a lot of the time (what almighty power invented ‘panic attacks’)………..I can’t even contemplate what those in our community without a support system are feeling right now1 -
Since it’s highly likely that Labour will be the next government I wonder what their attitude to all this will be.0
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You are right Ralph. Same for this and the bank account thing. I’m not even sure both will be in place before the next election. Labour would throw both things out0
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