The Autumn Statement 2023

Adrian_Scope

Hello @hawkbanana81. I wonder if UC ever updated your commitments after you were awarded LCW. When you go to the commitment section of your online UC account, what does it say there? You are correct that if you are in receipt of LCW then you should not be forced to work search. How long ago were you assessed as having LCW and do you still have the decision letter on your journal?

onebigvoice

Adrian_Scope said:

Hello @hawkbanana81. I wonder if UC ever updated your commitments after you were awarded LCW. When you go to the commitment section of your online UC account, what does it say there? You are correct that if you are in receipt of LCW then you should not be forced to work search. How long ago were you assessed as having LCW and do you still have the decision letter on your journal?

Posted before:

 I know its a worring time for all, but believe me when you think that you are alone in the fight to get "any benefits at all, or that changes that affect the way you get paid are aimed at you.

  They are not.  People like scope and even the unions even if you don't belong to one fight for reform.

This is where I got my name from, since being one voice against many, I found that by joining groupes like forum, and the activist part of UNITE, I can at least have a say, where others would take on board your opinion to formulate a plan.  This is how reform happens, documents and wording gets changed.  Yes sometimes thing are done behind closed doors but, WE HAVE AN ACE UP OUR SLEEVE?  INFACT TWO.  

1.  Accountability.  Even if you leave your job (as an MP) you are still accountable for your actions.

2.  A vote.  The ability for you to say what you really think about what they have done, for you, or the country.

  Pensions and payments, What happens to payments when migrated and how the calculations work, sick pay and care, there are loads of things discussed here every day.

  Make your point of view heard, Scope have a section that allows you to join the fight by E Mailing your MP so what you waiting for, use your opinion to make things count.  

As an add on:

  With the growing lists of people awaiting assessment, NOT FOR BENEFITS, BUT TREATMENT.  This is where people should be fighting and making them selves heard.

  There are people who are fighting, ( and I hate the word fighting) for reform, but what about the front line MP's who are supposed to be sorting out the strike action and getting the NHS up and running again BEFORE winter.

  We all know what is going to happen this year as its not something that hasn't happened before.  Old and disabled people are going to have to make a choice of heating or eating?  Either way the government has not made any inrodes into fixing the benefits system of assessment since the same people making the same decisions and the same mistakes into another year of cold and winter months ahead.

  We all hear that the cost of Disability ( or anyone claiming benefits) is more than some one that is able bodied, having seen quoted £950 / MONTH.  Yet most councils make sure that any rises in Benefits or pensions are still taken at the same rate?  Why not reduce the percentage like tax reductions so that a rise of 10% is actually a rise of 10%.

  We all know we are boardering on another epedemic, and with the snow that has already fallen what are the government waiting for?  A payment of £250 or £100 winter warm payment is nothing when you work out how much heating and energy costs have risen.  Add both together, £350 divided by 52 = about £7 POUNDS A WEEK.   Can you tell me where these MP's live and Who pays for their bills?  A Vperk of the Job?

  Well unless you have noticed we don't get PERKS, the government is always quick to react to and Benefits you get from benefits yet slow to react when they know there is a problem.

  How long have the NHS been on strike?  When was the last time they were round the table and for how long?  What happened during the pandemic?  Is this how they, the government support the NHS?

  Is this how they support the NHS on MY BEHALF?  I like everyone pay National Insurance into a pot, which supports the NHS not PRIVATE HEALTH CARE COMPANIES that these MP's state are a help to the NHS. 

  The NHS is or should be run by the NHS for the NHS and for the British public, and Private Health Care Companies should realise that they are NOT the main holders of the contract to supply health BENEFITS not assess what treatment may or may not fix the issues of the claimant.

 Believe me they are not.  In building the Nightingale Hospitals all over the country shows what can be done if they wanted to.  Why dismantle them all?  Or why not find a permanent site for them to be rebuilt and used by the NHS.

  These were FULLY KITTED UNITS that were to be used by the NHS?

  Staff to run them?  They asked people who retired to come back to work to do jobs that would free up other front line workers.  They didn't ask people who were sick or in LWRAG's who were unable to mobilise?  Did they pay them?  were there any arguements about pay or conditions?  We know that people that went back were not given the correct PPE or the working conditions were not changed to adapt to their needs? they were willing to let them risk their lives to "save"  with a carrot of we will remember what you did to help.  YET again we need an enquiry to tell us they were rubbish?  They did not react in time costing lives, spend MILLIONS OF POUNDS on unusable PPE, did not have enough stock to supply everyone, but were happy for you to take the risk.

  What will this enquiry do for US?  We already knew the problems, we already knew the NHS was in trouble, and how many years down the line are we and still no resolve?

  The only way to get the lists to shrink is to stop giving help to those that we vet who would not benefit from treatment and would only be a short term fix, as they would probably die during treatment if thery ever got any, or would die within 5 years.

  This IS A QUOTE, made by more than one MP's on how she would cut the waiting lists for treatment, yet again, the stiff upper lip and the hope that things will change is the British thing, after all, their all on our side.  ARN'T THEY?   Let accountability mean accountability.  If you were aware that some one was about to kill someone and you said nothing does that make you an accessory to the fact?  Is an appology enough to help people who lost loved ones because of their neglegence?  They seem capable of excepting a big title and the big bucks but not the responsibility that goes with the job?

  Don't they have to sign a contractual Disclaimer in excepting the job title, the Job description and and the money? 

onebigvoice

Adrian_Scope said:

Hello @hawkbanana81. I wonder if UC ever updated your commitments after you were awarded LCW. When you go to the commitment section of your online UC account, what does it say there? You are correct that if you are in receipt of LCW then you should not be forced to work search. How long ago were you assessed as having LCW and do you still have the decision letter on your journal?

Posted before:

 I know its a worring time for all, but believe me when you think that you are alone in the fight to get "any benefits at all, or that changes that affect the way you get paid are aimed at you.

  They are not.  People like scope and even the unions even if you don't belong to one fight for reform.

This is where I got my name from, since being one voice against many, I found that by joining groupes like forum, and the activist part of UNITE, I can at least have a say, where others would take on board your opinion to formulate a plan.  This is how reform happens, documents and wording gets changed.  Yes sometimes thing are done behind closed doors but, WE HAVE AN ACE UP OUR SLEEVE?  INFACT TWO.  

1.  Accountability.  Even if you leave your job (as an MP) you are still accountable for your actions.

2.  A vote.  The ability for you to say what you really think about what they have done, for you, or the country.

  Pensions and payments, What happens to payments when migrated and how the calculations work, sick pay and care, there are loads of things discussed here every day.

  Make your point of view heard, Scope have a section that allows you to join the fight by E Mailing your MP so what you waiting for, use your opinion to make things count.  

As an add on:

  With the growing lists of people awaiting assessment, NOT FOR BENEFITS, BUT TREATMENT.  This is where people should be fighting and making them selves heard.

  There are people who are fighting, ( and I hate the word fighting) for reform, but what about the front line MP's who are supposed to be sorting out the strike action and getting the NHS up and running again BEFORE winter.

  We all know what is going to happen this year as its not something that hasn't happened before.  Old and disabled people are going to have to make a choice of heating or eating?  Either way the government has not made any inrodes into fixing the benefits system of assessment since the same people making the same decisions and the same mistakes into another year of cold and winter months ahead.

  We all hear that the cost of Disability ( or anyone claiming benefits) is more than some one that is able bodied, having seen quoted £950 / MONTH.  Yet most councils make sure that any rises in Benefits or pensions are still taken at the same rate?  Why not reduce the percentage like tax reductions so that a rise of 10% is actually a rise of 10%.

  We all know we are boardering on another epedemic, and with the snow that has already fallen what are the government waiting for?  A payment of £250 or £100 winter warm payment is nothing when you work out how much heating and energy costs have risen.  Add both together, £350 divided by 52 = about £7 POUNDS A WEEK.   Can you tell me where these MP's live and Who pays for their bills?  A Vperk of the Job?

  Well unless you have noticed we don't get PERKS, the government is always quick to react to and Benefits you get from benefits yet slow to react when they know there is a problem.

  How long have the NHS been on strike?  When was the last time they were round the table and for how long?  What happened during the pandemic?  Is this how they, the government support the NHS?

  Is this how they support the NHS on MY BEHALF?  I like everyone pay National Insurance into a pot, which supports the NHS not PRIVATE HEALTH CARE COMPANIES that these MP's state are a help to the NHS. 

  The NHS is or should be run by the NHS for the NHS and for the British public, and Private Health Care Companies should realise that they are NOT the main holders of the contract to supply health BENEFITS not assess what treatment may or may not fix the issues of the claimant.

 Believe me they are not.  In building the Nightingale Hospitals all over the country shows what can be done if they wanted to.  Why dismantle them all?  Or why not find a permanent site for them to be rebuilt and used by the NHS.

  These were FULLY KITTED UNITS that were to be used by the NHS?

  Staff to run them?  They asked people who retired to come back to work to do jobs that would free up other front line workers.  They didn't ask people who were sick or in LWRAG's who were unable to mobilise?  Did they pay them?  were there any arguements about pay or conditions?  We know that people that went back were not given the correct PPE or the working conditions were not changed to adapt to their needs? they were willing to let them risk their lives to "save"  with a carrot of we will remember what you did to help.  YET again we need an enquiry to tell us they were rubbish?  They did not react in time costing lives, spend MILLIONS OF POUNDS on unusable PPE, did not have enough stock to supply everyone, but were happy for you to take the risk.

  What will this enquiry do for US?  We already knew the problems, we already knew the NHS was in trouble, and how many years down the line are we and still no resolve?

  The only way to get the lists to shrink is to stop giving help to those that we vet who would not benefit from treatment and would only be a short term fix, as they would probably die during treatment if thery ever got any, or would die within 5 years.

  This IS A QUOTE, made by more than one MP's on how she would cut the waiting lists for treatment, yet again, the stiff upper lip and the hope that things will change is the British thing, after all, their all on our side.  ARN'T THEY?   Let accountability mean accountability.  If you were aware that some one was about to kill someone and you said nothing does that make you an accessory to the fact?  Is an appology enough to help people who lost loved ones because of their neglegence?  They seem capable of excepting a big title and the big bucks but not the responsibility that goes with the job?

  Don't they have to sign a contractual Disclaimer in excepting the job title, the Job description and and the money? 

worried33

carbow32 said:

It was really badly written and misleading.  However say if all reassessments have been stopped. Then if Labour get in (which is seemingly likely).  Could they over turn the lot and start assessments up ? Just interested.

Also I sell a few craft items (am LCWRA Substantial Risk).  I feel like giving this up in case its thrown in my face.  So they are not making me want to do something they are making me want to stop something.

The bit that is unclear as B&W pointed out is if the reassessments for LCWRA have stopped (or about to be stopped) or is that going to wait until the WCA changes come into play which would mean 2025.

If Labour were a proper opposition of course they would have actually asked this in parliament in response to the budget, but because they are too busy concerned with imposing their own austerity to get tory voters onside with them, instead it seems we need to rely on charities, the media, and sites like B&W to get the answer.   There is a chance someone like Timms will ask the question but he is just one person with very limited questions.  I dont know if there is a DWP select committee any time soon where details might come out.

According to this it looks like currently is just cost of living payments and SSP being discussed.

https://committees.parliament.uk/committee/164/work-and-pensions-committee/

On your question about Labour they can if elected yes choose to go in their own direction, whether that would be carrying on as things are (pre 2025 plans), keeping the current plans or doing their own WCA reform.

carbow32

Thanks for the info.  So it is limbo land at its finest.  I do keep an eye on the B and W thread.  I would say at the moment ppl that are saying they have a reassessment were possibly triggered by the system pre 22/11/23.

I really don't know what to do about this crafting items online.

Dave1993

The DWP says: “We will specify the circumstances, and physical and mental health conditions, for which LCWRA Substantial Risk should apply. This will include protecting and safeguarding the most vulnerable, including people in crisis and those with active psychotic illness. We will work with clinicians to define the criteria and what medical evidence is required from claimants and people involved in their care, to ensure the process is safe, fair, and clear. 

Does this mean i wont be forced to work i have schizophrenia?

poppy123456

Dave1993 said:

The DWP says: “We will specify the circumstances, and physical and mental health conditions, for which LCWRA Substantial Risk should apply. This will include protecting and safeguarding the most vulnerable, including people in crisis and those with active psychotic illness. We will work with clinicians to define the criteria and what medical evidence is required from claimants and people involved in their care, to ensure the process is safe, fair, and clear. 

Does this mean i wont be forced to work i have schizophrenia?

No one really knows exactly what any of it means yet because no further details have been announced.

worried33

carbow32 said:

Thanks for the info.  So it is limbo land at its finest.  I do keep an eye on the B and W thread.  I would say at the moment ppl that are saying they have a reassessment were possibly triggered by the system pre 22/11/23.

I really don't know what to do about this crafting items online.

Seems B&W got an answer, the assessments are to continue until the changes in 2025.

https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/news/reassessments-for-support-group-and-lcwra-have-not-stopped

WhatThe

worried, I think this is right and assessments will continue until 2025 under the current Health Reassessment Programme - it has replaced the National Reassessment Programme of 2011-2014. 

The announcements and statements are ambiguous because this is politics and politics is the 'art' of lying. 

Nobody can be forced to work, I mean how!? Claimants with health conditions will be offered support to prepare for or return to work, just as ESA regulations intended.

Anyway, Timms signed off these regulations in March 2008 so Labour understands the WCA very well. In 2015, he argued that claimants in the Support Group had been "abandoned" unlike claimants in WRAG who were being helped back into work (I say that very loosely). All these changes were legislated for by the 2016 Welfare Reform and Work Act. 

Then we stopped talking about it but it didn't go away and is relevant now. Somebody here said, oh that's in the past, let's deal with now but it's not in the past at all.

Tumilty

worried33 said:

The consultation suggested the changes were going to be much harsher, it does seem like they have back pedalled a bit with the announcement which is a good thing.

My interpretation of the DWP statement, is that the vast majority currently in the LCWRA group will not need to have another WCA, this is for both UC and ESA.

However there is a chance this exemption might not kick in until 2025, as I agree the two statements are slightly contradictory.  But my original interpretation was they are probably going to soon stop referrals, new claimants in 2024 will be under the existing WCA.  New claimants from 2025 onwards new WCA, and LCW looks like will still be reassessed so those will also be under new rules from 2025.

--

If Labour get elected there is a chance this wont happen, but I personally think they will be less compassionate, especially as they announced yesterday they are planning to have a new harsher assessment in place of WCA, whilst the Tories are going in the other direction and wanting to remove the assessment from existing claimants.

thanks, so does this mean people on ESA for people that claimed it a while back?.. Does winning a tribunal make any difference to having another WCA? thanks 

poppy123456

Tumilty said:

worried33 said:

The consultation suggested the changes were going to be much harsher, it does seem like they have back pedalled a bit with the announcement which is a good thing.

My interpretation of the DWP statement, is that the vast majority currently in the LCWRA group will not need to have another WCA, this is for both UC and ESA.

However there is a chance this exemption might not kick in until 2025, as I agree the two statements are slightly contradictory.  But my original interpretation was they are probably going to soon stop referrals, new claimants in 2024 will be under the existing WCA.  New claimants from 2025 onwards new WCA, and LCW looks like will still be reassessed so those will also be under new rules from 2025.

--

If Labour get elected there is a chance this wont happen, but I personally think they will be less compassionate, especially as they announced yesterday they are planning to have a new harsher assessment in place of WCA, whilst the Tories are going in the other direction and wanting to remove the assessment from existing claimants.

thanks, so does this mean people on ESA for people that claimed it a while back?.. Does winning a tribunal make any difference to having another WCA? thanks 

No one knows exactly what it means or whether the changes will go ahead. We have a General Election this year which could change everything. 

Tumilty

Apologies if i got it wrong but the support group and not being reassessed?, am i correct there, i'm sorry if i read wrong.. Is there any update on what was said in the autumn statement, i need a refresh as i've not been able to get updates.. Regards

poppy123456

Tumilty said:

Apologies if i got it wrong but the support group and not being reassessed?, am i correct there, i'm sorry if i read wrong.. Is there any update on what was said in the autumn statement, i need a refresh as i've not been able to get updates.. Regards

For most people Support Group and LCWRA are not be reviewed at the moment but they will resume some point in the future. 

There's been no further updates to any potential changes so you haven't missed anything. 

worried33

I have been seeing posts where people are told, this is speculation and to not make decisions based on it,

The WCA changes are not speculation, there is published documents from the DWP.

poppy123456

worried33 said:

I have been seeing posts where people are told, this is speculation and to not make decisions based on it,

The WCA changes are not speculation, there is published documents from the DWP.

They are proposals and nothing is set in stone yet! 

kandarohi

@Hannah_Alumni @Rosie_Scope @Albus_Scope

Could any of you please put this as an announcement pinned to the top of the benefits forum?

The government has opened a consultation on PIP 29th April. I hope you will all give them feedback so they can see all the different situations

What you do is you go here https://www.gov.uk/government/consultations/modernising-support-for-independent-living-the-health-and-disability-green-paper/modernising-support-for-independent-living-the-health-and-disability-green-paper#how-to-respond

And you click to respond via the online form.

The consultation closes on 22nd July.

Rosie_Scope

Hi @kandarohi, this is something we're working on at the moment, we'll get something up as soon as we can