pip tribunal won then bad news

cristobal

@twanker - it seems that you are very critical of @ilovecats comments (who, obviously, can speak for his/ herself) and you seem to be against both filling out the form yourself, getting help to fill it in and 'going into the finer details' at a face to face interview.

 Do you have any positive advice for anyone just about to start a claim for PIP?

Threesticks

I sit here in disbelief, the infighting and helping the DWP is astounding. If I didn't know better I'd have said there were trolls who work for the DWP answering your questions. The DWP, and their agents, ( i.e. atos et al ) must be so desperate to make big profits out of you. And you lot are helping them.

My advice, get as much independent information as possible. There are websites out there full of links and information to help you. All I read on here is, opinions, assumptions and personal attacks, with the odd useful link thrown in. I'm very disappointed, but I must say, not surprised.

cristobal

@ilovecats - I genuinely think advice on filling in the form vs someone else doing it would be useful...I'll make another topic as we've all gone a bit off-topic here...

April2018mom

I think it’s a good idea. I could write a letter to complain about the paperwork but that is not recommended. In other words it’s a exercise in torture and negativity. 

Matilda

Disability Rights UK and CAB sites both have good guides to completing PIP forms.  Disability Rights include a draft diary you can adapt.  Recommend people include a 7 day diary with their PIP form.  My tribunal panel based most of their questions on my diary.  They awarded me enhanced both components.  Diary shows what your daily life and disability problems are.  CAB make the point that you should not tick the 'it varies' box in the getting around section but tick a specific distance box.  Ticking the 'it varies' box gives assessor too much scope to decide that much of the time you can walk a long distance! 

twonker

Matilda said:

CAB make the point that you should not tick the 'it varies' box in the getting around section but tick a specific distance box.  Ticking the 'it varies' box gives assessor too much scope to decide that much of the time you can walk a long distance! 

Wrong? for telling the truth and as it is?

cristobal

twonker said:

Matilda said:

CAB make the point that you should not tick the 'it varies' box in the getting around section but tick a specific distance box.  Ticking the 'it varies' box gives assessor too much scope to decide that much of the time you can walk a long distance! 

Wrong? for telling the truth and as it is?

@twonker - most, if not all, of your posts just contradict what others advise.

You seem to have a lot of experience of the PIP process. Do you have any positive advice for claimants?

Matilda

The point is, @twonker, assessors are notorious for twisting the facts.  If this were not the case, then 71% of appeals would not succeed.  

twonker

cristobal said:

@twanker - it seems that you are very critical of @ilovecats comments (who, obviously, can speak for his/ herself) and you seem to be against both filling out the form yourself, getting help to fill it in and 'going into the finer details' at a face to face interview.

 Do you have any positive advice for anyone just about to start a claim for PIP?

I'm not against anything. I have read that Ilovecats (as an assessor) would prefer to have, if she was carrying out my assessment, a poorly completed PIP2 claim form than one that was completed at a meeting with a Welfare Rights organisation. She is of the opinion that the latter will generally result in an automatic face to face assessment.

All I want to know is what I should do with the PIP2 form next May 
Is it better to go see the CAB and get help filling it out or struggle on my own with no help or advice sought? 

twonker

ilovecats said:

cristobal said:

@twanker - it seems that you are very critical of @ilovecats comments (who, obviously, can speak for his/ herself) and you seem to be against both filling out the form yourself, getting help to fill it in and 'going into the finer details' at a face to face interview.

 Do you have any positive advice for anyone just about to start a claim for PIP?

Unfortunately I fear that Twonker/Yadnad has little positive advice for anyone. 

To clarify, a claimant does not have to talk in depth about what terrible things they have gone through, just explain how it affects them today. 

Back to the Activity 5 point, you cannot just expect the assessor to say, ‘Oh I see you’ve ticked the box to say you have incontinence, here have 2 points’. 
Otherwise everyone would tick it.

I would refer you to your earlier post in which you said, 'unfortunately, it’s only by exploring the finer details does one understand the greater level of disability'. 
Maybe I am missing the point, but the finer details would be those details that the claimant probably doesn't want to be brought back up to the surface?

Plus you stated that you would sooner have a badly completed claim form that was completed by the claimant than one that was completed at a meeting with a welfare rights organisation?

All I am trying to do is gather concrete and consistent advice regarding what I should be doing when my review comes up next May and how I should handle the face to face assessment that will follow.

CockneyRebel

Whether you have a PIP2 form or an AR1, either should be filled in as a new claim, and submitted with any relevant supporting evidence.

It is your claim, and unless you are physically unable to fill in a form, then the expert on your conditions and effects that occur is you. You have plenty of time to research the descriptors and criteria but if they are unclear then you should seek clarification. Nobody can tell your story better than you, you do not have to write an award winning text book but you do have to paint the clearest picture of your life so that the assessor understands your needs

rainbow58

CockneyRebel said:

Whether you have a PIP2 form or an AR1, either should be filled in as a new claim, and submitted with any relevant supporting evidence.

It is your claim, and unless you are physically unable to fill in a form, then the expert on your conditions and effects that occur is you. You have plenty of time to research the descriptors and criteria but if they are unclear then you should seek clarification. Nobody can tell your story better than you, you do not have to write an award winning text book but you do have to paint the clearest picture of your life so that the assessor understands your needs

what is a PIP2 form and an AR1 form?

rainbow58

rainbow58 said:

CockneyRebel said:

Whether you have a PIP2 form or an AR1, either should be filled in as a new claim, and submitted with any relevant supporting evidence.

It is your claim, and unless you are physically unable to fill in a form, then the expert on your conditions and effects that occur is you. You have plenty of time to research the descriptors and criteria but if they are unclear then you should seek clarification. Nobody can tell your story better than you, you do not have to write an award winning text book but you do have to paint the clearest picture of your life so that the assessor understands your needs

what is a PIP2 form and an AR1 form?I  am unlikely to get any supporting evidence as the GP i had has just retired and  has not been fully supportive,he said my hand Xrays showed RA but denied telling me this saying it was osteoarthritis.

poppy123456

rainbow58 said:

what is a PIP2 form and an AR1 form?

PIP2 is the form you filled out when you first applied and the AR1 is a review form.

rainbow58

ilovecats said:

cristobal said:

@twanker - it seems that you are very critical of @ilovecats comments (who, obviously, can speak for his/ herself) and you seem to be against both filling out the form yourself, getting help to fill it in and 'going into the finer details' at a face to face interview.

 Do you have any positive advice for anyone just about to start a claim for PIP?

Unfortunately I fear that Twonker/Yadnad has little positive advice for anyone. 

To clarify, a claimant does not have to talk in depth about what terrible things they have gone through, just explain how it affects them today. 

Back to the Activity 5 point, you cannot just expect the assessor to say, ‘Oh I see you’ve ticked the box to say you have incontinence, here have 2 points’. 
Otherwise everyone would tick it.

why not that is the truth-the PIP test scores points for using aids -not where they are obtained from.nor how long it takes one to walk a distance but how far one can walk with or withput an aid and the pain etc exoerienced.
same as "cannot make an unfamiliar journey without another person or aid"-they ewere told this but chose to ignore it.i have not "gone to unfamiliar places "as it causes great distress and panic attacks.have had to rely on dsomeone to take me,i am not going to my nieces wedding because the "journey to an unfamiliar place " will cause me great distress.
I have my meals prepared for me to heat in the microiwave cos i cannot safely use an oven.that scores points niot how often i have a carer,who also washes and dries my hair,washes my back.-point scorers.as is "unable to get in or out of a bath unaided -" 3 points.not whether i should get a carer to help me out of the bath.as the judge stated.i have my nails cut because i cannot bend down or reach to do so.
I go out  once a week which amounts to at a maximum of 52 days a year i go out-that is less thanthe 50% they state,

poppy123456

The PIP self test is good, if you understand the descriptors and what they mean. A lot of people don't understand them and will use the self test and hugely over score their self and automatically think they qualify when some don't.

Matilda

In my experience, assessors and tribunals like to keep things simple.  At my tribunal, the doc kept asking for how long could I walk and I kept replying that it depends on a lot of factors.  So, he dropped that and went on to how far.  He was only interested in how far itself, not on factors like pain, stiffness, fatigue, pavements, kerbs.

If assessors and tribunals want to keep things simple, so should we (without excluding essential details) or otherwise they're likely to get confused and err on the side of awarding few or no points.

rainbow58

poppy123456 said:

The PIP self test is good, if you understand the descriptors and what they mean. A lot of people don't understand them and will use the self test and hugely over score their self and automatically think they qualify when some don't.

both AGEUK and the CAB did the PIP self test and scored me 24 points for care and 22 for mobility.

rainbow58

Matilda said:

In my experience, assessors and tribunals like to keep things simple.  At my tribunal, the doc kept asking for how long could I walk and I kept replying that it depends on a lot of factors.  So, he dropped that and went on to how far.  He was only interested in how far itself, not on factors like pain, stiffness, fatigue, pavements, kerbs.

If assessors and tribunals want to keep things simple, so should we (without excluding essential details) or otherwise they're likely to get confused and err on the side of awarding few or no points.

if they want to keep things simple why spend 2 hours interrogating.if the assessors want to keep things simple why was mine typing lengthy responses to my short or single word or non existent responses-why make up the **** he did and why lie?

twonker

cristobal said:

twonker said:

Matilda said:

CAB make the point that you should not tick the 'it varies' box in the getting around section but tick a specific distance box.  Ticking the 'it varies' box gives assessor too much scope to decide that much of the time you can walk a long distance! 

Wrong? for telling the truth and as it is?

@twonker - most, if not all, of your posts just contradict what others advise.

You seem to have a lot of experience of the PIP process. Do you have any positive advice for claimants?

You are not supposed to exaggerate difficulties on a PIP claim form. Telling the assessor/DWP that those difficulties never vary and allowing them to think that the difficulties exist 24/7 is plainly wrong.

Yes is the answer to that question, Up to now I am looking forward to my 4th re-assessment in 12 months time.so have plenty of experience of the system.
Unfortunately the system has a nasty habit of letting me down.
Positive advice? Possibly prepare yourself to have an assessors report that is full of in accuracies and incorrect assumptions. Be prepared to fight the DWP. Don't get stressed and don't feel intimidated.
Last of all prepare to not be believed at every stage of the process.