Hi, my name is coffeetable! 0 points awarded on my PA4 form
Comments
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It's not good to request the SOR and ROP if you're not planning on trying to find the error in law. It's a lot of extra work for the judge to do and you should really only request them if you're planning on taking this further.
There's no right or wrong words you should use when filling out any forms. Just tell it how it is and include those real world examples.
Rather than request both of those, which probably isn't going to help you going forward, it would have been so much better for you to have done some research to try to understand the PIP descriptors and what they mean a little better than you do. It really does help to have some understanding.
I'm not saying you don't qualify but there are some people with disabilities that don't because if you don't meet the descriptors you won't score enough of points needed for an award.1 -
I understand assessments can be complex, and I'd appreciate some guidance on how to best present my situation. English isn't my first language, and I sometimes struggle to express myself clearly. For example, I experience fatigue and breathlessness throughout the day. Previously, I misunderstood fatigue for dizziness, so I didn't mention it during my assessment. Additionally, during the tribunal, when asked if I cook independently, I said yes due to anxiety. However, arthritis actually prevents me from cooking. My doctor has diagnosed me with severe anxiety and prescribed antidepressants, which I didn't mention at the tribunal either. Unfortunately, my anxiety significantly impacted my ability to communicate effectively during the tribunal. I plan to use an interpreter in the future. (I use AI to correct my grammar for all the posts posted in this forum)0
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I'm filing a fresh application and outlining all the challenges I'm facing. Clear communication is key. I'm following the terminology recommended by YouTuber Charlie Anderson, whose article was featured on Daily Mail. While everyone experiences conditions that affect daily life, not everyone qualifies for PIP. The key is to explain your situation using the descriptors outlined by the DWP. In my previous application, I may have unintentionally missed following these descriptors. For example, I have IBS and spend more time in the toilet than a typical adult and need assistance getting up due to arthritis. If I don't mention using a grip bar( which I use it) to stand, I might lose points. In my initial application, I mentioned the difficulties I had using the toilet and with arthritis, but I didn't specifically mention the grip bar. Clear communication and using DWP terminology are crucial. i thought i would qualify for points if i have arthritis, but defining or explaining how it affects by using the key words or terminology is what I need.0
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Glad you've found something you're finding helpful @coffeetable.
Just be sure to balance your YouTube research with lots of reputable advice from different sources too. I don't know much about this particular Youtuber, but it's always good to double check anything you watch with some other advice to make sure you're getting the right information. I think Poppy might have suggested this earlier, but if you need some extra help, there are often organisations that can help support you locally. They might be able to help you understand the descriptors in more detail if you need some extra support with this. Just something to think about, anyway
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As discussed earlier in this forum, I plan to reapply as a new applicant. I visited a physiotherapist for my arthritis in both knees, Achilles tendon condition, tennis elbow, and tendon muscle pain in my wrist and shoulders. I have been referred to a hospital physiotherapist and am currently waiting for an appointment, which I was informed could take several months.
I have a recent MRI scan showing arthritis in my knees and a current ultrasound report confirming an Achilles tendon issue. These reports were obtained after the rejection of my first tribunal. I was advised that reapplying with old reports would not be beneficial.
My question is, while I am waiting for the physiotherapist appointment, can I apply using the discussion notes from the physiotherapist referred by my GP, or do I need to wait for the actual appointment letter? Additionally, I have been prescribed painkillers and antidepressant medication.
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If you're planning on sending the MRI scan images then they will not be able to view those. It's not so much old reports that aren't going to help, it's what's actually written in the reports. PIP isn't awarded based on any diagnosis so a letter telling them about your diagnosis isn't going to award you points.
You do not need to wait for the physio appointment to reapply. I still think you're missing the points I was trying to make earlier in your thread.
I mentioned real world examples but you said you already gave those in your original form the first time and for your MR request BUT what sort of examples did you give? Did you go into full details of exactly what happened the last time you attempted each descriptor that applies to you? Can you give me one of those examples that you gave?
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@coffeetbale
… here is an example, this is a fragment of my reference, to 12. Moving Around which contains real events from my life.
"…In March, I went with my son for an appointment with a specialist at XXXXXXXXXXX Walking Centre. Due to my chronic back pain (please see the attached letter from XXXXXXX dated XXXXXX).
Upon exiting the car, my son suggested that he measure the distance from the car to the Reception using his steps and the time it took us to cover that distance. It turned out that due to the pain in my back and right leg, as well as shortness of breath caused by my hypertension, we covered approximately 45 steps in about 2.5 minutes.
Assuming that 1 step is on average 80 cm, covering 36 meters (45 x 0.8) took us 2.5 minutes. This means that I am unable to cover this distance in a reasonable time period, whereas a healthy individual covers a distance of 30 meters in 1 minute.
After the examination, which lasted about 40 minutes, due to the pain in my back and right leg, I was unable to again cover this distance and return to the car. Therefore, I asked my son to bring the car to the entrance.
This clearly indicates that I am unable to do this repeatedly…"
After the appeal, I went from 0 points to 20 in total for the mobility component. and Tribunal was canceled.
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I'm not planning to send MRI images, but rather the written reports. I know that PIP isn't awarded based on any diagnosis alone. However, to prove that I have a condition, I need to provide evidence, such as documentation for hearing loss (an audiology report) and arthritis (an MRI written report).
Two years ago, when I first applied for PIP, my application was rejected because there was no ongoing physiotherapist input, no ongoing medications, and no specialist input. This is why I inquired about the physiotherapist appointment. I cannot simply state verbally that I am waiting for an appointment, which I said for my previous application and it didn't work at all) as I don't believe I will receive points for just providing examples without medical evidence. Although real-world examples are crucial for earning points, I still need to provide evidence to prove my condition.
To avoid rejection, I thought it would be prudent to wait for the physiotherapy appointment instead of just stating that I was referred to physiotherapy.
Thank you for the advice on real-world examples. I have never claimed to have provided real-world examples in my PIP application; if it appeared that way in this thread, it was a genuine mistake. Following your advice, I will ensure to prepare real-world examples for my reapplication.
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Hi Honeyhoney, I have no words to express my gratitude the help you have provided for my PIP application. I will think of writing similar real-world examples I face in my day to day life.
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A diagnosis is very rarely in question. This is where you said you gave anecdotal evidence. (real world examples)
You would be better off doing to research before applying again, which I'm sure was advised earlier in the thread, rather than wait for an appointment because you think you need proof for something. This is often a good place to start.
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… I also started my MR from the link provided above by poppy, this time I followed it carefully... give it some time until you are sure you understand what is written there... Good luck :)
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Thanks, Honeyhoney and Poppy123456. I will start preparing and get back to this thread as soon as i'm ready to apply again with all the examples.
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Hi Honeyhoney and Poppy123456. I have prepared one of the acitivity for washing and bathing. Please let me know whether it is correct way to address the issue.
Aids: Use grip bar to get in and out of the bath, use stool in the bath to sit, and I use long-handled sponges to wash the body.Regarding the activity of washing and bathing, my ability is significantly hindered by arthritis in both knee and Achilles’ tendonitis. To enter the bath, I require the support of a grip bar. However, due to fatigue, discomfort and pain, I am unable to complete the washing and bathing activity within a reasonable time frame, as it takes at least twice as long to wash or bathe as someone without my condition. The pain and discomfort in my lower limbs prevents me from washing properly; therefore, I must use a stool within the bathtub to sit and long-handled sponge to wash my lower body. This limitation clearly indicates that I am unable to perform this activity repeatedly. Additionally, as a hearing aid user, I must remove the device prior to washing and bathing, which places me in a vulnerable position where I cannot detect emergency alarms. Furthermore, due to pain in my wrist from tendonitis and tennis elbow, I require the supervision and support of another person—even with the grip bar—to safely enter and exit the bath. My wife provides this essential assistance.
Real world example:
My Wife works so I am usually on my own during the day and it’s not safe for me to have a bath. I have to wait for her to be there. On a particular Sunday, I went to the bathroom to wash my body, so I gripped the bar to enter the bathtub, I experienced significant pain and discomfort in my wrist and elbow due to wrist tendonitis and tennis elbow, necessitating my wife’s assistance to safely get in, on that occasion it took at least more than 2 minutes to safely get in. Before commencing my bath, I removed my hearing aid and entrusted it to my wife, who then closed the door and remained outside, anticipating my completion of the bath. Meanwhile, she was attending to cooking tasks and inadvertently neglected them, resulting in the activation of the smoke alarm. Although she promptly addressed the kitchen situation and returned to assist me out of the bath, she informed me of the smoke alarm incident—a critical alert I was unable to hear due to the absence of my hearing aid. This incident underscores the inherent risks of bathing alone and clearly indicates that I cannot reliably perform this activity without supervision.
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Can some moderators or admin help me with the above please
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Hey @coffeetable how can I help?
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I was advised by poppy and honeyhoney to go through the PIP assessment guide part 2: the assessment criteria and prepare according to it. I have prepared and pasted above. I want them to have a look and see whether the format is good, ignoring the conditions I want to ask them is the written format is correct or not as I have added real world examples too.
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Ah I see @coffeetable Poppy and HoneyHoney are two kindhearted souls who do this in their own time, they're not mods or admin. But they ARE super helpful. 😊 But yes, that example looks great, you've covered the main points and shown that you cannot do that descriptor safely, or in a reasonable time.
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I have not included any mention of safely in my previous correspondence. Can I simply add a sentence addressing safely? Furthermore, do I need to prepare for all the activities I am involved in, using real-world examples?
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Hello coffeetable… unfortunately none of us is an assessor or a decision maker to evaluate your application. There is also no universal template guaranteeing a PIP award.
However, in my opinion you should go in the same direction as above. Also written by Albus, you should raise the issue of safety in this activity if you use hearing aids.2 -
Thank you Albus and Honeyhoney.
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