Official thread: ‘Get Britain Working’ White Paper released Tuesday 26th November
Comments
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I never had a problem with wca also no mention of pip going to hit us with wca changes then few months later pip the life instantly felt worse since labour got it survived Conservatives never thought labour would be so never
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Hello @charlie72. To protect your identity, I've removed the PDF and copied the text from the letter into your comment instead, as the PDF contained your personal email address.
Thank you for taking the time to share it with us.
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I got to say I’m having to say I’m having to take more and more time outs from the scope forum (and many disability commentators on social media) who are scaremongering and refusing to look at the bigger picture - that compromise will be needed and we’re need to pick our priorities carefully
you know what’s keeping me up at night right now? - that we are charging towards a kemikaze/stride far right Tory gov as of now (who honestly make sunak/stride look like domestic cats in comparison)
You all must of noticed the increase of far right media, commentators and a increasing amount of the general public stepping up their (yes uneducated, but it’s hard to learn if your foaming at the mouth in blind anger) attacks on welfare claimants and disabled ppl as an extension - gov targeting disability payments in the past has be described as ‘red meat’ policies in the past which is a good description as many of the public think/act like carnivorous animals when angered and the logic is ‘feeding them red meat’ will have a calming effect.
I’ve noticed the past few years more and more people openly supporting society moving towards a more eugenic ideology (the survival of the fittest viewpoint) - in around the next 24 hours uk society could be one step closer to that worrying vision depending on the opinion of 650 individuals!
There is not enough financial help available for the uk disabled population - I’m not disputing that………but the uk is not in the financial position to provide the extra funds (at least with zero attached conditions) and that’s before you include those who try (and succeed) to game the system via lying or exaggerating their health or disability. And as much as I hate admitting it more likely than not red meat policies (that leaves a bad taste in the mouth, leaves ppl in poverty and prematurely ends lives) in black & white terms does save the government money (gotten from general public taxes) as many disabled are only able to take money from the state but not contribute anything back.
On paper (when thinking only in black and white economic terms) ‘red meat’ policies to address the sharply increasing benefit bill is the ‘easy’ option - it satisfies certain quarters of the general public and will save significant coin (and it’s easy to close ears to suffering disabled) - on past quite recent quotes I think both kemikaze & stride would carry out this ideology (and probably on steroids)
Right now labour are being very hard to read - both starmer and Kendall have used some pretty appalling language towards the disabled the past few months - however when reading the white paper I don’t get (what some people are saying) that labour are just slightly sugar coating past very recent Tory ideas (and prehaps upcoming welfare reforms will prove that to be true) but I personally didn’t read it that way…….. it needs a lot of work and input from all areas of the disabled community but I see it as potentially a first draft of some ideas that could have positive outcomes for both disabled community and the state
But labour need time, cooperation and compromise (and for all sides to be realistic)to have any chance of improving things for all parties - labour aren’t taking the obvious red meat approach yet (but I fear if the disabled community keeps on jumping too conclusions and attacking them on decisions that have clearly not been made or finalised - they may conclude that it’s too much effect/money to try and make disabled community happy and they should just take the easy option and go on full on red meat)
Using one of my analogies- essentially labour need to figure out the way to offer this increasingly large amount aggressive welfare/disable claimant hater quarter of the public a very convincing ‘red meat substitute’ but they can’t achieve that without disabled and welfare claimant cooperation and both sides needs to give something to get back!4 -
also when was the wca so popular?
To many disabled ppl get no points and have to go to tribunal but also a number of ppl successfully fake health awards and get an award they shouldn’t (fraud is low on pip but less so with uc I believe)
Both uc standard amount and lcw are too low so lcwra is the prize every claimant aims for (meaning far too many people in that group)
I have many ideas on this but uc standard rate should be raised at least £20 a week (but more conditions so choosing to be on the dole not an option), the lcw easier to be awarded but not much more in terms of cash and the lcwra reserved for those condition that are most serious
And let’s do away with this ‘work related activity’ which can be just as scary as work for many disabled……….actually just ditch the word ‘work’ altogether………… ‘contribution’ is a much more open term
don’t have time to expand right now so above probably reads very badly - but Kendall is right when she said that many disabilities fluctuate (though she didn’t mention that some a lot day by day but others not so much) and the relationship between disabled ppl and how they can best contribute to society does need a total wipe and reset (but also individually tailored and not one size fits all………….if Kendall if thinking x sizes fit all as the white paper is leaning towards that probably won’t be enough either imo)0 -
What compromise and how do we pick our battles we are powerless what to compromise getting a job when you know you won't be able to keep it up I don't understand what you mean
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To me an acceptable compromise would be not to impose sudden conditionality upon people and for anything discussed to be voluntary based. I'm open to talking to people remotely where I'm not under threat of sanction if they are genuinely trying to help.
But I've found myself on the wrong end of an assessment a few years ago and was immediately put on job seekers conditionality. You cannot cope with that if you are not able to work and to be honest it's scarred me to this day.
I really don't think conditionality and sanctions should be brought further into health categories. The results would be heartbreaking.
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Hi Morgan I noticed my messages not going through albus looks first then puts them through thanks
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Hi can you approve my message to strawberry thanks
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I agree me personally I wouldn't go to appointments I would hide in my house terrified noting would make me go the only thoughts I have now is hopefully be a few years off and who knows I might not be here
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Hi @Catherine21 all of the team are in charge of accepting/denying messages in the comment queue, but please remember we're only rota'd on to work between 10am and 6pm.0 -
Watching question time last night it was interesting to listen to the fact that one person said that the majority of pip claims are now due to mh and he wasn't convinced that we have suddenly got sicker.
Other countries have all gone back to work, but the uk hasn't and they can't really work out why.
It was then mentioned that as a country our unemployment benefits are the lowest meaning that people go on to claim the sickness in order to live. So it's those people they want to weed out.
The job centre was going to be about work and not welfare and getting everyone back in to work.
That all sounds possible and positive I guess. 2029 was mentioned and pip reforms.
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The problem as I see it is we will be the future claimants as esa will have been merged into lcwra. They won't know when you were originally signed as unfit, or what for as I don't the wca goes with us.
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My thinking on this is because it puts everyone in the same place and they have a simpler system.
However it's called limited capacity to work isn't it, not, you can't do anything at all. We will still have to wait fit the green paper, but my concern is the pip reforms, dropping the wca and bringing in the health element that I read was going to be for those on pip as a linked benefit.
If disabled and long term sick people didn't people have mh issues before claiming, they will have a a result of all the uncertainty.
It just reads as every five years they change things to try and save money, the changes must cost millions.
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Oh OK thanks albus
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I've read again and can see your point of view if we keep stoking the bear we will lose I think your right just my thoughts on this but I think the more people push forward I think kier starmer won't back down at all I think it makes him more defiant
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And getting us on UC signing a contract to say will conform to UC rules
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What I don't understand is how can they push wca forward to 2025 if thier making thier own changes wouldn't it have to go through house of lords
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Albus what is the difference between disabled and long term sick ?
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Hey @Catherine21 In the UK, a 'disabled' person has a long-term physical or mental impairment that significantly affects their daily activities, protected under the Equality Act 2010.
'Long-term sick' refers to someone off work due to illness for an extended period, but this doesn't necessarily imply a permanent or significant impact on day-to-day activities.
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So everyone who reassessed for pip next coming years and have award past 2029 will more likely be ok ?
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