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  • secretsquirrel1
    secretsquirrel1 Community Member Posts: 2,052 Championing

    I’m sure I read on here that it can’t be passed as a money bill

  • rach_90
    rach_90 Community Member Posts: 38 Contributor

    I might be being naive here… but the way I see it, is that there won’t be any u-turn (if any) until the consultation period comes to an end.

    I do believe it will be watered down - but with them looking the good guys… probably along the lines after the consultation period and receiving all the responses, and listening to all the voices and concerns we’ve decided we need to reassess and come up with a new proposal.

    I do think there high likelihood that they will probably go down the route of if you get 12 points, without 4 points in a DL descriptor (possibly more they could up it) you will keep pip, perhaps at the standard rate. This is a partial win for gov’t … they save money but have satisfied the rebel Labour MP’s. Either way Labour are finished and they know it.

  • Amaya_Ringo
    Amaya_Ringo Community Member Posts: 417 Championing

    When the bus passes for pensioners were first introduced, they were for everyone over sixty. Prior to that the situation was a pass that allowed pensioners to pay a discounted fare, and a similar one for people with disabilities. When they introduced the free pass for pensioners, they eradicated most of the eligibility for the disability pass and made it much harder for disabled people to get any kind of bus discount. They also, for a while, made it harder for carers to travel with disabled people without having to pay full fare. There is now a C+ option but that was not there from the start.

    You mentioned a Freedom pass, that's a London thing. I'm talking about the England bus pass, which is issued free of charge to eligible residents living in England.

    When I said there were people in full time work who drove everywhere getting bus passes, I was talking about actual people I know in this area where I live. I know people who still do this, albeit fewer of them work now the age has upped to state pension age. But there's one regular bus user on our bus who also drives to Scotland fairly often. There are older people who use the local buses who never drive, like my parents. And those who do.

    This is how the system actually works. Making it worse is that, even when someone does qualify based on Mobility (Moving Around), if the person is under PIP review at the time the bus pass expires, then they lose their eligibility unless they can go and get additional medical information to cover the time their case is being heard. You have to pay for a doctor's letter, these days. Not everyone can even get access to a GP. Some people lose their independence for months on ends because of these shortfalls. But the guy who drives to Scotland? His comes automatically in the post.

    I have some knowledge of processing applications for bus passes, so I've seen how the system works both for age and disability eligible passes. 90% of older people passes are qualified for using an active driving licence.

    Sidenote - I have 12 points for Planning a Journey on PIP. This is because I cannot navigate. I can't thus walk to save bus fares, because I get lost and put myself in danger. I also can't safely cycle. Despite this…I'm not automatically eligible for a bus pass. I had to get an additional letter from my GP stating why I needed the bus pass - and every time I come up for renewal, I have to check whether I need to get more evidence. The criteria are constantly being amended at government level, and this has implications down the line. There are people in my area who qualified through various initiatives who have also now lost their passes due to the funding running out.

    I am glad you find it easy to get your Freedom Pass renewed, but it's not that way everywhere.

  • YogiBear
    YogiBear Community Member Posts: 415 Pioneering
  • luvpink
    luvpink Community Member Posts: 4,562 Championing

    I haven't seen it.

    Maybe it will be on the news tonight.

    I could be wrong but they seem to be focusing on younger claimants.

  • lincsgranny
    lincsgranny Community Member Posts: 201 Empowering

    Disability and MH don't have a age so hope they don't do that it's all just wrong.

    This Government is so Messed up

  • luvpink
    luvpink Community Member Posts: 4,562 Championing
    edited June 2025

    @lincsgranny

    I agree but it seems to be in the media a lot about young 'economically inactive'

    and mental health.

    We should know more tomorrow.

  • lincsgranny
    lincsgranny Community Member Posts: 201 Empowering

    Fingers crossed we get some information as not letting us know anything is cruelty for us all

  • luvpink
    luvpink Community Member Posts: 4,562 Championing

    I'm dreading it but they have kept us in limbo for too long.

    We need to know our fate one way or another.

  • lincsgranny
    lincsgranny Community Member Posts: 201 Empowering

    Totally agree the impact this must be having on our health.

    It's like being in a bad zone all the time no break from it. Fingers crossed for tomorrow 🤞

  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User] Posts: 1,170 Championing
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  • lincsgranny
    lincsgranny Community Member Posts: 201 Empowering

    Hope they don't get passed i really do

  • bton1968
    bton1968 Community Member Posts: 156 Empowering

    Can you give more details on this please…

    Substantial risk ?

  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User] Posts: 1,170 Championing
    The user and all related content has been deleted.
  • WhatThe
    WhatThe Community Member, Scope Member Posts: 5,660 Championing
    edited June 2025

    "I am glad you find it easy to get your Freedom Pass renewed, but it's not that way everywhere."

    AR, I'm more confused now. I don't have a Freedom Pass and I've never had one. All I have is a 60+ bus pass.

    It has to be renewed annually at a cost of £10 which I would rather not have to do. My ESA card got me half-price fares and I had to renew that annually. I can't count the number of serious meltdowns I suffered in those Post Offices and job centre getting them to validate my qualifying award. I don't have to put myself through any of that now.

    I got my 10% discount at a frozen food store today but I don't understand the connection with your travel pass.

  • Amaya_Ringo
    Amaya_Ringo Community Member Posts: 417 Championing

    You were the one who mentioned a Freedom Pass, not me? I've not been to work today, so I'm pretty sure my brain didn't confuse that xD.

    I'll reiterate, though. Back when they first introduced passes for over 60s (as was then), they took away the equivalent discount for disabled people, except those they deemed 'most severe'. So a lot of people who previous qualified no longer did, and a lot of carers also lost out. This was a direct consequence of funding the free over 60s passes.

    In my area there is no charge for a bus pass, unless it is lost and a replacement is required. There is a processing charge for Blue Badges, but that's all. This may be the confusion as different areas have different rules.

    In my area, people who have what is now the over 66 (pension age) bus pass usually use their active driving licences as their proof of ID to qualify for it. Once on the system it is sent out automatically every five years. Even if they never use it. Meanwhile disabled people need to provide evidence every time their pass comes up for renewal, and the criteria can change. This can be complicated, just like any other disability related claim.

    I have 12 points on PIP planning a journey because of navigation but only qualify for a bus pass because my doctor wrote a letter stating why I am not safe to drive. While I broadly support older people having a bus pass, the reality is that the initial introduction made things harder for disabled people. So the reality is that not all disabled people who can't drive get a bus pass, while all older people, regardless of whether they can drive or not, are eligible.

    Sorry everyone for the diversion from the main topic. Back to green paper now.

    The 9million I thought was related to the WFA U-turn eligibility?

    Its interesting they use the term substantial in substantial risk, since the Equalities Act defines disability as something that has a substantial and long term impact. The government do not seem to like that word as much as severe.

  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User] Posts: 1,170 Championing
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  • secretsquirrel1
    secretsquirrel1 Community Member Posts: 2,052 Championing
    edited June 2025
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    just read this in the mirror. Apparently labour are proud to scrap the vagrancy act , I guess they don’t want us breaking the law when we are all homeless. I will be sending this to Rayner and asking if she’s so proud of Labour for starting the welfare system does it mean she’s voting against cuts

  • WhatThe
    WhatThe Community Member, Scope Member Posts: 5,660 Championing
    edited June 2025

    You said - "Obviously they've amended the system since, but it is still harder to get a disabled bus pass, and still requires a lot of evidence, while the age related one renews automatically."

    I said - What changed to make it harder to qualify for a Freedom Pass?

    Amaya_Ringo, a 'disabled bus pass' is a Freedom Pass.

    My 60+ bus pass costs me £10 a year to renew in person at a Post Office. That's all.

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